Quibbles (PROBABLE SPOILERS!! Non-readers, play safe and stay out)

Discussion in 'Fantasy / Horror' started by kged, May 11, 2011.

  1. kged

    kged Gloriam Imperator

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    Maybe it's because I can't sleep, maybe it's because I'm just naturally curmudgeonly, but I feel a need for a griping thread. We are all (me included) gushing wildly over the show, and I instinctively want to balance that with a little corner of the board for complaints, queries, and general whiny piffle about the little (or big) things in the show which are not as we would like them.

    Actually I may be letting myself down here by kicking off with what borders on a serious question - in the conversation in ep3 where Ser Jorah and Rakharo are swapping professional opinions, Ser Jorah says that a broadsword's main job is to pierce plate armour. Does that sound right to any resident sword buffs? I'm sure I've read recently that the general current school of thought is that swords were for cowing the populace (i.e. unarmoured civilians), and perhaps equally for simply showing that one was of the knightly classes and above, but that for combat against an armoured knight they wouldn't do much more than inflict bruises; the tool for the job of killing a man in armour being a warhammer, or poleaxe. Any thoughts?

    Quibble 2: they say "Dothrakki", not "Dothrarki". Being from England may be in factor in this one...

    Quibble 3: I don't like the pronounciation of "Hoe-dur" either. Too much like odour! In my head it was always "Hoddor", and even though that's clearly wrong it still feels right to me.

    Come along, one and all, join in the snarkery! We need some antidote to the lovefest!
     
  2. columbob

    columbob Registered User

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    That's how I always pronounced it. There's no R after the A, I don't know how you ended up with that pronounciation. It's either long A or short A.
     
  3. R.J.

    R.J. Is Winter Coming?

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    Ooooh, a thread for whining, just my kind of thing. Always pronounced it doth-RAH-kee, by the way.

    1) King's Landing: Doesn't look like the city as described in the books at all. Far too mediterranean for my tastes.

    2) Kit Harrington's performance in Episodes 1-2

    3) Decrease of titties per episode

    4) Winterfell establishing shots. Looks like a Star Wars town with those weird tower roofs.

    5) Direwolves almost absent much of the time. Especially Ghost. So weird when he suddenly appears as if out of a portal through time and space in Ep 4.

    6) I feel the directing isn't that interesting in the first two episodes for many reasons.

    7) The whole prologue bit is off.

    8) Pacing is occasionally off.

    9) Feels like characters are teleporting between locations, no feel of the relative distances between places

    10) Marillion

    11) Renly

    12) Dragon eggs look dodgy

    13) Khal Drogo's eyeliner

    14) Some awkward acting in a few scenes (not many fortunately); thinking primarily of Arya when she talks to her dead sitting on the chest in Ep 3, and Daenerys talking to Jorah about how crap her brother is in Ep 4 (the maester's path scene), Yoren

    15) Bit unfair to complain about stuff that is not in there (like the direwolves) but ... I miss certain things. Simple as that.

    16) The soundtrack...bland

    17) Completely understandable from a technical point of view, but I miss the grandieur and scope of the novel; everything is so small, like the tourney of the hand

    18) Petyr Baelish is far too wooden

    19) Sandor Clegane is meh

    I'll stop here lest you think I don't enjoy the TV series, 'cause I do. So for balance, here are 19 things I really dig as well:

    1) Mark Addy as Robert Baratheon, really good performance

    2) The swapping war stories scene in Ep 3 is perfect

    3) Love the scene where Tyrion comes to break fast with his siblings at Winterfell (Episode 2)

    4) Peter Dinklage owns even though the character isn't exactly novel-like

    5) Sean Bean is great

    6) The Syrio Forel/Arya scene in Ep3 is lovely

    7) The series is highly entertaining

    8) Lots of lovely nods to readers of the series that fly by non-readers

    9) Strong performances almost all across the board

    10) Daenerys naked

    11) The Castle Black scenes in Ep 3 and especially Ep 4 really come close to the feel of the novel

    12) Love that scene with Old Nan and Bran ("I know a tale about a boy...")

    13) Episodes have exciting endings so far

    14) Loved the Mycah/Joffrey/Arya/Sansa-scene.

    15) The "new" scenes are for mostly improvements

    16) Mixing up Bran waking up with Lady going down was clever

    17) The banter between Jory Cassel and Ser Jaime in Ep 4

    18) Scene decoration is often top-notch and detailed; Grand Maester Pycelle's office is a good example

    19) Lots of dialogue straight from the book
     
  4. End Of Disc One

    End Of Disc One Registered User

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    Sansa can't pronounce her sister's name.
     
  5. R.J.

    R.J. Is Winter Coming?

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    Nobody can :D They all say "ajja" or something.
     
  6. kged

    kged Gloriam Imperator

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    AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRGGH

    I am now aware that Bronn is played by Jerome Flynn.

    JEROME FLYNN.

    Yes, that one.

    Overseas folk may be baffled here; let me explain that Jerome Flynn is half of one of the most execrable "double acts" of all time, Robson & Jerome. They were actors in a very low quality military soap opera together, and then started releasing records...yes, it really is as atrocious as that makes it sound. I mean, come on - BRONN doing this?

    So now I already hate Bronn, after one line in ep4. Damn, he is going to have to be GOOD to win me round.

    :mad:
     
  7. Ornery Wyvern

    Ornery Wyvern 50% Certain

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    Wow, I would have been a lot happier had the other half of Robson and Jerome been cast, because he was excellent - and rather Bronnish -in the latest series of being Human. But I'm not too worried, the casting has been excellent so far, I look forward to seeing how it plays out. :D
     
  8. Evil Agent

    Evil Agent Saturn Comes Back Around

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    Re: Jerome Flynn as Bronn. Many people had the same reaction as you... until they saw him in character. Mark my words, he's going to be one of those bits of awesome surprise casting you never saw coming (kind of like how everyone doubted Mark Addy at first).

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2011
  9. Orbison

    Orbison Making it so.

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    I'm unimpressed with the architecture of Winterfell and King's Landing too. Those weird towers in Winterfell are ridiculous, and I'm surprised GRRM let them go ahead.

    Scale is another issue I have but at least it can be forgiven to an extent, given that it's a TV programme. The Dothraki Khalasar isn't nearly big enough, nor are some of the external scenes like the Tourney of the Hand. There are also a distinct lack of wide shots, or establishing shots when we focus on a different set of characters.

    I think a bit of tasteful CGI would fix many of these problems.
     
  10. Evil Agent

    Evil Agent Saturn Comes Back Around

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    The choice was not GRRM's. It was made by the production designer, and I don't think GRRM was even asked for his approval on those sorts of details. He himself has said that the show looks different from how he imagines it, but still good.
     
  11. tragic

    tragic sultan of smug

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    No way! That's amazing. I'd completely forgotten about them. Don't be too harsh on the boy though; remember, Ian MacShane made his breakthrough in fecking Lovejoy.

    My gripes:

    1. Sean Bean. Controversial, I know, but I just don't buy him. He's not hard enough. Perhaps I'm just biased after his turn as the most irritating computer game character of all time in Oblivion.

    2. The sex is a little bit Channel 5 (another Brit only reference I guess - C5 made a reputation for sticking low-brow US soft porn 'thrillers' and much loved 1970s British sex comedies on its late night slots).

    3. Sandor Clegane's awesome - but not on screen enough!

    4. A little too much Basil Exposition stuff.
     
  12. kged

    kged Gloriam Imperator

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    I may have to eat this one. Still early days, but based on last night he seems to be an unexpectedly convincing Bronn. Evil Agent's prediction may be coming true.

    It occurred to me on the way home tonight that if I hadn't read the books, I'd have no idea why Tyrion is called "The Imp". Dinklage's performance is superb - but I'm feeling more and more like he isn't performing the Tyrion we know from the page. He's got all the smart, and the witty, and the dreadnought-sized confidence, but where is the trickiness? That may be impending, given that we are now at The Eyrie and his silver tongue is going to be sorely needed soon, but he is definitely "nicer" than in the books. At least up to now.

    Today's minor quibble - why do people keep calling Arya "boy"? She's cute as a button!

    Oh yeah - am I the only person in the world who really likes exposition? I look forward to it; it makes any film or tv show deeper and richer, for me. I want to know why as well as what.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2011
  13. Evil Agent

    Evil Agent Saturn Comes Back Around

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    Girls in that world usually dress like Sansa (pretty dresses, fancy hair, etc.). Arya was wearing pants and a shirt (boy's clothing), and was filthy. She still looks like a girl to us, but I don't think it's that big of a stretch for someone to mistake her for a boy.

    Did anyone notice she's suddenly sporting the same hairstyle as Sean Bean? She looked like a little mini-Ned, especially when standing next to him. I loved that!
     
  14. thirstyVan

    thirstyVan the Thirsty

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    I don't have much in the way of nitpicks. They gotta do what they gotta do, after all. I think it's all a little too rushed, but again... meh.

    But srsly. What the hell happened Sunday night. Did they really need to shoehorn in the relationship between Renley and Loras? Where the heck did that come from? I mean, I vaguely remember it being subtly hinted at in the series. Maybe... I can't remember all the details that well.

    Thoughts?

    EDIT: Oh, and did they kill Jorry (sp?)? Cos wtf?!?! He's kind of important later on!
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2011
  15. Johnny B

    Johnny B Registered User

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    Yes, Jory was killed. He was killed in the same scene in the book......
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2011
  16. Evil Agent

    Evil Agent Saturn Comes Back Around

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    Jory dies in the book, in the very same scene. Maybe you're thinking of another character?

    And Renly and Loras are definitely gay in the books as well, although it's only hinted at.
     
  17. thirstyVan

    thirstyVan the Thirsty

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    I thought Jory showed up later, with the Lightning Lord and that whole gimmick. Wasn't he the one that identified Arya when she ran into them? Or was that someone else...
     
  18. Evil Agent

    Evil Agent Saturn Comes Back Around

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    That was some guy named Harwin (son of Hullen).
     
  19. Johnny B

    Johnny B Registered User

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    ----------
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2011
  20. Johnny B

    Johnny B Registered User

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    I watched this episode again last night and it struck me that they should have cast someone with a little more muscle tone for Loras. It seems that someone with the ability to unhorse The Mountain would have a better physique. This guy has the build of a 7 year old boy and doesn't look as if he could lift a lance let alone hit someone hard enough to knock him down.