[Zsinj]

I've been wondering for a long time why in The Two Towers are there orcs/goblins in the Uruk Hai armies that don't look like Uruk Hai? I mean, all the Uruk Hai basically look like more beefed-up, demonic versions of drow only with black hair instead of white, right? So why are there orcs/goblins with them that don't look like them, like the one that wanted to eat Merry and Pippin's legs, and the one who said "Why haven't we had some meat?!!!" Or is there actually supposed "normal" orcs/goblins with the Uruk Hai?
My other question is I've heard that in the Silmarillion (which I haven't read yet) there is a "dark elf". Now is this dark elf like one of the drow from Forgotten Realms, or is he more like just an evil, nasty pale-skinned elf like Dalamar the Dark from Dragonlance?

[BarVybe]

Not explained really at all in the movies is that the band of orcs that captures merry and pippen is really a mixed group of orcs from Orthanc (Uruk-hai) and orcs from Morder (the smaller variety). They have a power struggle and the Uruk-hai win out.

Grishnack (sp) - the one who chases the two of them into the woods, is a Morder orc trying to steal the hobbits away and take them to Sauron.

As for the dark elf in the Silmarillion - i don't recall him looking particularly different - more like he came from a cursed family and was "dark" by his actions. (but i could be wrong - memory's a bit fuzzy on that one.

- Pete

[Gildor]

Concerning the different Orcs/goblins in the party that captured Merry and Pip, in the book it was Misty mountain goblins as well as Uruk Hai that fought with Boromir. The Orcs from Mordor then joined the party afterwards, wanting to take the hobbit to Sauron, but getting muscled out of it.

As to how the film did it, they just were there, i think.

The dark elf you are referreing to is called Eol ( if my memory serves me well ). He dwelled alone in an isolated part of Doriath, or a glade of trees near there.

Though in answer to your question on looks, neither really. Though he was a bit of a Nasty person anyway.

Though the term dark elf isn't assoicaiated with evil or misdeeds, they are shunned by the other 'light' elves beacuse they have not seen the light of the trees, as they were unwilling to travel. Or i could be getting two elvish races mixed up.

Im not sure now, the 'unwilling' i know didn't travel, but there were some elves of the original three groups, Teleri, Noldor, Vanyar ( are they right? ) that when Orome guiding them to the crossing that Ulmo created, a few elves strayed from the path, and dwelled in Beleriand .... ach, curses wheres my Silmarillion copy ...

Silmarillion spoiler

This may be a bit sketchy, but Eol was the one that captured the daughter ( or was it wife ) of the king of Gondolin, forced her to have a child by him. And that child then betrayed Gondolin to Morgoth's forces

Anyway, hope all that crap helps :)

[Evil Agent]

In the book, and in the movie, Merry and Pippin were kidnapped by a band of Uruk Hai from Isengard. Then, in the book and the movie, a group of Mordor orcs intercepts and joins them. That's the whole reason for the confrontation between Ugluk (from Isengard) and Grishnak (from Mordor). Ugluk says he's bring the hobbits to Saruman, whereas Grishnak wants to take them to Sauron and/or eat them.

The movie actually got the Uruk Hai perfect, IMO.

[BarVybe]

So with the "dark elf" thing - yes, i think that there are whole groups of elves referred to as "light", "twilight", "dark" or something like that based on how far west they make it.

but "dark elf" in general doesn't have a drow type context or anything evil / bad. That's just Eol and his line....point being that tolkien doesn't have "dark elves" in the general common fantasy sense of that term.

[Gildor]

The movie actually got the Uruk Hai perfect, IMO.

They did aye! Though some of the accents made me laugh, one sounded as if he was a cockney sparraw, apples and pears and all that.

'What do you smell ?'

'Manflesh.' :D

[Evil Agent]

The orcs were supposed to have cockney accents, which Tolkien wrote them with in the books as well.