[Moraven]

Yes, J, that is a good point. When work is EXCELLENT it can still be published and read. That is beyond a doubt. And Epic fantasy has a tendency to be huge. I guess I just agree with Holbrook though. It's hard to get an agent or publisher to even look when you are brand new to the publishing world. Shorter works -- as far as my research has indicated -- get published faster. After building some base for yourself, longer works seem more marketable.

Of course, I believe Wizard's First Rule was Goodkind's first novel, and it's long. Then again, i'm not a huge fan of his. I feel like he could cut TONS out of his books and still have a good story. His imagination is good, his world is great...he just takes way too long to get to the point.

[Power to the J]

Thats why--IMO--it is a better strategy to get a few short stories published to show that you have the necessary talent. That way an editor or agent or whatever can see that you know how to write and they'll trust you with a longer book that way.

[Abby]

The book is already split into <cough> seven books, and this is only the forerunner tale that is absolutely essential for the overall legend. [...] Once the book makes a killing, then I'll go George Lucas on it and rehash the extended version and the super-added scenes version.

Hee hee hee! You sound exactly like me five years ago.

FYI, Stephen King's unabridged "The Stand" is about 520,000 words. I did research on this. Keep in mind that he's Stephen King (famous) and this was the unabridged version (publishers abridged it first).

[Tony Williams]

But, if a book is of exceptional QUALITY, then it could be 800,000 words and still get published, because if it's good enough people will go and buy it. LotR, WoT and SoT are three of the most succesfull fantasy series of all time, and everyone's looking for the next big thing.

In other words, if your book is good enough, it'll get published--end of story.

It might, as long as it's likely to appeal to the readers of other fat books which are currently popular. If it's different, beware...Frank Herbert's Dune was a fat novel for the mid-1960s, and Donaldson's Thomas Covenant story was even fatter in the late 1970s. Both of them were turned down by some forty publishers before being accepted.

The problem is that nowadays there aren't forty publishers to go to, due to consolidation in the market, so you might run out of firms before finding one willing to take the risk.

[Power to the J]

It might, as long as it's likely to appeal to the readers of other fat books which are currently popular. If it's different, beware...Frank Herbert's Dune was a fat novel for the mid-1960s, and Donaldson's Thomas Covenant story was even fatter in the late 1970s. Both of them were turned down by some forty publishers before being accepted.

The problem is that nowadays there aren't forty publishers to go to, due to consolidation in the market, so you might run out of firms before finding one willing to take the risk.


With a good enough track record (see what I posted like 3 posts above:) ) you'll be able to get a good agent and then if she/he is good you can get that longer book published. Also, if you dont want an agent (I don't know why, but.....) you can just put that in a query somewhere to show you can handle it.

As far as legnth really goes, lets try a few things:

1) What is the longest book you've ever read?
2) What was the legnth of the last Sff book you read?
3) ' 'Fantasy?

[gh0ti]

I'm sure I read Stephen King saying that when coming up with the Gunslinger he wanted to write the longest book ever made, but missed by some way. No idea how long it actually is, just thought I'd throw that in. IMO doesn't matter how long your book is, just so long as you maintain the reader's interest.

Oh yeah, you say your novel is 80k words and that's a quarter, I'm guessing that you mean a quarter of a single book. That would be quite long for me, but as others have said, it depends on the writer.

[Tony Williams]

With a good enough track record (see what I posted like 3 posts above:) ) you'll be able to get a good agent and then if she/he is good you can get that longer book published.
Writing short stories is qualitatively as well as quantitively different from novels - some people write great shorts and poor novels, and vice versa. Personally, I've never been interested in writing shorts, although maybe I'll give it a try some day.

As far as legnth really goes, lets try a few things:

1) What is the longest book you've ever read?
2) What was the legnth of the last Sff book you read?
3) ' 'Fantasy?

1) I really don't know, as I don't normally do a word count, but I suppose LOTR must be one of the longest.

2+3) SFF includes fantasy as far as I'm concerned. The last one I read was a fantasy, of about 50,000 words according to one reviewer, although that was admittedly unusually short. I enjoyed it, though - it seemed the right length for the story.

[Shanako]

I would say that the number of words in a book is less inherently important than getting your stuff published and read.

I have written close to 20 published articles (in business fields) and I always have to balance out the optimal vs. just getting it done to the point where it will get published....:)

You are a writer and writers write.

I wouldn't worry about finishing a whole collection etc. Write the first book and get it sent off to an editor.

I think that 85% of perfection makes you money and trying for the extra 15% may keep the ship from ever sailing IMO.

Good Luck!

[Power to the J]

[QUOTE=Tony Williams;399616]Writing short stories is qualitatively as well as quantitively different from novels - some people write great shorts and poor novels, and vice versa. Personally, I've never been interested in writing shorts, although maybe I'll give it a try some day.

But some are good at both. Either way, it's just about getting your name out there.

[tatianac]

Hello, everyone, I'm new to this site and forum. I got here by trying to find out how long LotR proper and LotR incl front and back matter is. My own calculations show c. 460,000 and c. 520,000 words respectively, from sampling.

Well, I don't see why people worry about lengths of c. 200Kwd. I myself am writing an SF/Alternate saga that is now almost 4,500,000 words long, and should hit 5 million by the fall. It may top out above 6M in 2010, after 7 years of work.

Naturally, it shows numerous self-organizing signs of inherent breakpoints, not to be wondered at here.

Without revealing too much, it's what Wagner would do today if you turned him loose with state-of-the-art computers and unlimited email]tatianacovinbudgets, updated him since 1883, and told him to pipe down about some of his more objectionable notions.

200K? I've blown through that much in 2 months of serious work several times.

Tatiana Covington