[Thoughtcriminal84]

Most of those "Zen and the art of" books are excellent. I believe the only one I've ever read that didn't move me was Zen and the art of Driving http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/smile.gif

Pluvious, I tend to agree with most of your last post. But the concept that the people who don't see a need to compare and quantify things like writing are not skilled in the 'art of thinking' bothers me. With all of the varied opinions on this board (and elsewhere), I seriously doubt that there is a reader anywhere who doesn't simply know what they like to read...It seems to me that is a inborn part of human intelligence, not something that is learned.

But of course, I could be wrong.

[Pluvious]

Hmm...I don't think I said people who feel the "need" to compare don't think. I was simply stating that there is a place for comparisons in the world and on this board, and that I don't think it necessary for others to say that you cannot compare. My reason for these long posts is because I have heard several people say that you cannot compare-which I of course don't agree with. If comparing, though, please examine the authors more deeply-or the posts do become redundant-which is I believe why people continue to say "we have done this before", or "to each his own".

[Bardos]

Pluvious, in order to convince someone, you have to show him/her evidence. You have to be able to say that this is good, because A+B+C = what you want to prove. And this is not good beacuse A+B+C = also what you want to prove.
But in order to make this comparison the two (or more) persons involved must mave, more or less, the same values. Also must know, and except, that the A, B and C exist. If some doesn't know about A, and another doesn't approve C, then you are never going to convinse him/her.
Now, in the web, there are so many people, with so many different values, that its very, very difficult to convince them, IMHO.

[FitzChivalry]

The concept that we can compare everything is true because well, we can.
But the questions is if you are going to get to any results or agreement about the comparison or is it a useless tool in an arguement about the quality of a book.

I think that when it comes to such a subjective thing like a book you'll find it very hard to convince anyone that your opinion is right. The easiest analogy is to food, sure you can compare two differnet kinds of food, you can say this one is too sweet and the other is too bitter, but can you convince someone that one of the foods is better?

So there are some things that easier to compare and some things that are harder, and with books that naturaly have many aspects to compare, and anyone can have different values about any one of the aspects it's really hard to convince someone that your opinion is right. Hence the "to each his own".

[Pluvious]

THE PURPOSE OF COMPARING IS TO SEE DIFFERENCES IN THINGS...

You don't have to convince someone about a value such as one being better, but you can make some points that will demonstrate who and what you are. Hopefully in the process you may get someone to think, and that is all you can hope for.

Just don't tell me to stop comparing...cause that is like telling someone to stop thinking. Please tell me you agree with this.

[Thoughtcriminal84]

I agree with you, Plu. Compare away.

[Thoughtcriminal84]

yep, I agree with you. Wise and good people can sometimes disagree, but the cool thing is that we can do it respectfully. yep.

[Bardos]

Ofcourse, I agree with you, Pluvious! http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/wink.gif Never said you should stop thinking. Think and compaire, ofcourse!

I only said that: if you see you can't convice someone, don't drag the conversation pointlessly.
That's all.

[FitzChivalry]

Hey Pluvious, if you are comparing just for fun, compare away.
But if you do it because of the Tolkien arguemnt, be ready for it not to have real results. that was my point.

[ChrisW]

*Bump*

Interesting if ancient thread.