[Nathan Carter]

Dolls severed head... whispering in her ear about the frightning things he's going to do to her boyfriend Ken...

This forum is so eerily quiet, Are the horror lovers that sparse? I mean... the Fantasy forum has a post every 20 seconds. I would go talk to those people, except I'm only now near the end of the first fantasy novel I ever read in my life, and they all use endless abbreviations about every book they talk about, like some kind of secret fantasy code, where you have to be ordained by a wizard of the sacred crest to have the arcane knoledge to decipher the lost language.

I'll stop ranting, I'm sure they're all fine people. But I grew up reading horror, I'm more acquainted with it, so here I am.

Well, I suppose I shouldn't post all this mindless dribble without giving you something to respond to.

One topic I might inquire of fellow horror readers, is do you get scared reading them?

Personally, very few have ever been able to give me even a jolt. I like horror for other reasons, the style, the twists and madning turns that keep things interesting. Sci-Fi creates its own rules it abides by, as does fantasy, but in horror... anything goes.

My favorite author without question is F. Paul Wilson, in his best work he writes circles around his competition. In his worst work, he's still interesting enough to finish the book.
And I discovered him after growing up reading King, Straub, Koonts, McCammon... and he slid right into the top slot.

The Keep, as I shared in a previous post, is the only novel that ever gave me a few chills. I don't know how he did it, perhaps it was the subtle way he slipped the horror in with the even more appalling reality. But, either way, most books just dont effect me in that manner.

How bout the rest of you? Do you read horror to get scared? Or because Tom Sawyer bores you, and you need a higher octane of fiction?

[estranghero]

Hmmm, interesting question.

Actually, I grew up reading horror books, courtesy of my Dad's Stephen King. However, I graduated to fantasy and science fiction later on as I got older. But my fascination for horror never went away.

My imagination, as I grew older, grew wilder to stay ahead of my more-logical thinking and that meant finding the right things to scare me. I once stepped into a darkened theatre chamber and found out the phrase, "the darkness all-encompassing pressing down", was quite true.

And maybe because since I DO have a wild imagination, I have yet to find a horror writer that can really scare me. Fortunately, King's writings does that to me.

However, I'm not that knowledgable about horror writers and I think that why I'm more finicky about this genre than, say, fantasy.

I've read samples of the current horror writers like Dean Koontz, Brian Lumley, Anne Rice and I've yet to crow over their works like I do with, say, George R.R. Martin in the fantasy genre.

Some, like Charles L. Grant, seem to work though I'm holding my judgement. Others, like Brian Stableford, seem to have a lot of potential.

So maybe it's because, as you said, I need a higher brand of octane to read horror.

On a final note:

but in horror... anything goes.

Actually, I believe the same way but with the fantasy genre! http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Fenn628]

I grew up on horror. It is still my favorite genre, but I have read so much of it, that it was getting hard to find a lot of books that interested in me. The I read the Dragonlance Saga, Deathgate, WOT, SOT, Otherland...Up until I started the Dragonlance books, my only exposure to Fantasy was Tolkein, and I was of the opinion of Why Try Budweiser when you know Guinness is better. I am glad that I tried others because I would have missed out on a ton of good books.

Mike

[Nathan Carter]

There go those abbreviations again!!

<Runs at Fenn with his hacksaw, laughing maniacally>

But really, it would be nice to know what books you are talking about, please, for those of us who are fantasy illiterate, spell out the actual names. (At least here in the minority of the horror forum)

Also, something I've noticed. You people seem to talk as if you grew out of horror, like it was a childhood novelty, that became too trivial to matter anymore. This disturbs me.

I remember a time when Horror was the leading genre, when you could walk into a circle of readers and the latest works of King and Koonts were on everybodys lips. Now, when you talk to your average fiction reader, fantasy certianly seems to be the leading runner. (except for the vast majority reading mainstream fiction of course)

I wonder why the worm has turned. Though it's becoming clearer as I discover this realm of speculative fiction.

[estranghero]

Okay, I've been giving this some thought while I was driving home. Here are some of those thoughts...

Basically, if science-fiction is the wise, adventurous older brother of the speculative fiction family, and fantasy is the "I-don't-get-no-respect" commercially successful younger brother, then the horror genre is the weaker mentally dysfunctional cousin of the first two.

Why do I say this? Well, looking at the bookshelves, it seems that if fantasy has it bad on having commercial tripe all over their sections, the horror seems to be divided into two: the commercially-viable books (King, Koontz, Rice, etc.) and the B-books (for books that look like the b-movie versions). Though both sections seem equally divided, they're both rather small (in this part of the world anyway).

I know that horror is a success in both commercial and artistic aspects in other fields (like movies). My question is why hasn't this translated well into the literature field? Is this the reason why the horror literature genre suffering from some kinda multiple personality disorder?

Whew! Further thoughts to follow...

Btw, Nathan, WOT- Wheel of Time series (Robert Jordan or RJ), SOT- Sword of Truth series (Terry Goodkind or TG), ASoIaF- A Song of Ice and Fire series (George R.R. Martin or GRRM). Let's see, what else...

[Nathan Carter]

Well... first let me thank you for the clarification of those annoying tag letters... now I can use them to drive other people insane!! MUHAHAHAHAHA!!!

then the horror genre is the weaker mentally dysfunctional cousin of the first two.

I laughed out loud at this, and I see your point. There is much I could say, much more I could speculate, but I'll keep it short.

I think that the general concept of horror in and of itself, attracts people who wouldn't normally read. People who enjoy the fullness of a novel, over a two hour film, demand a certian intelligence. Good horror writers create detailed characters, haunting atmospheres, and at least the phantom of logic driving the plot. But try reading a slasher flick on paper... a big waste of time!

I think the better horror authors go unrecognized, and the mainstream ones produce so stinkin much that people are unaware of their GOOD work.

[estranghero]

Yeah but the good author shouldn't also explain too much because as I once read in another forum, horror works if you don't stumble across explanations while yer running screaming from monstrous fear.

Since I'm a horror neophyte here, who would YOU recommend for horror writers, barring Lovecraft and King?

And what have people heard on the Abyss line of horror books, as well as Thomas M. Disch?

[Llama]

The commercial horror genre is DYING, and good riddance, frankly. Who's killing it? The publishers who continue to place their bets on a tiny contingent of best-selling authors (Rice, King, Koontz, Saul) who year after year put out the same unoriginal uninspired tripe and the misguided readers who continue to pay for it.

With few exceptions, you will not find good horror fiction put out by large publishing houses. It's being put out by small publishers (like Night Shade, Silver Salamander, Subterranean, Cemetery Dance) and is available online or from specialty dealers like Overlook (or if you're lucky, sometimes even from Amazon).

I am so tired or hearing of King, Koontz, Rice...King, Koontz, Rice. READ SOMETHING ORIGINAL, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! The Internet offers incredible resources for the reader who can be bothered to search them out. Go out and find something exciting to read, not the same old regurgitated crap.

You want some recommendations?

THOMAS LIGOTTI. This is hands down the most important horror writer alive. Go out and look for his short story collections, NOCTUARY or GRIMSCRIBE or SONGS OF A DEAD DREAMER or THE NIGHTMARE FACTORY. He is poetic, oblique, dense, deep, beautiful, frightening, intelligent, everything some hack like John Saul is not.

BRIAN McNAUGHTON's THRONE OF BONES is one of the most interesting short story collections to come around in a while. The paperback is now being published by Wildside. Read it.

ED LEE. Violent, sexual, sadistic, gory, over-the-top and very very funny. Check out GOON or take a tour of Hell in his new one, CITY INFERNAL. (And if you're not afraid of being profoundly grossed out, read THE BIGHEAD.)

TERRY LAMSLEY. Intelligent, literate, scary ghost fiction, available only from Ash-Tree Press, who also publish folks like Paul Finch and Chico Kidd and Steve Rasnic Tem. You've never heard of them? Do yourself a favor, go to their website and check them out!

JACK KETCHUM. Violent, suspenseful, unputdownable, unforgettable. Read OFF SEASON or THE GIRL NEXT DOOR or STRANGLEHOLD or OFFSPRING. He will put you through the wringer.

Or how about Lucy Taylor or Charlee Jacob or Gerald Houarner or Tim Lebbon? You gotta look for these guys, though, you can't just go to the local superstore at the mall and hope they'll fall in your lap. The mall offers safe uninspired tasteless food at the food court and safe uninspired tasteless mental food at the bookstore. Explore! Live a little!

[Nathan Carter]

I would agree with Llama only to a degree, certainly horror is on the decline commercially, but this is only because its mainstream books have been on the decline for over a decade.

True, you can find a few good authors out there in the vast expanse of the neglected. But one should also remember the talent that origanily launched these careers that now seem to sputter with the drudgery of hackicity.

And it seems that no matter how many times I mention his name, he STILL gets ignored! I swear I've laid him out in every forum I participate in, but no one acknowledges his existence, or takes note of my recomendation. (except for the superior minded Corwwyn, and AuntiePam of course http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/wink.gif )

Read THE KEEP or THE TOMB by F.Paul Wilson.

I honestly have no higher recomendation, when those hook you, read the rest of the advasary cycle and slip into his clutches. You might be lucky enough to find The Keep or The Tomb in a bookstore, though they might have to order them for you. But I'm afraid your going to have to do some tracking for the rest of the advasary cycle, used book stores, ebay, even try libraries! I've seen a few of his books there! Imagine! Finding a book in the library of all places!

[estranghero]

Easy Llama, you'll bust a spring there. You know I always take note of your recommendations. http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/wink.gif Though didn't you make a recommendation on Disch before?

Like I said before, I'm really into fantasy/ science-fiction so the horror is new territory for me. I also don't want to get into the argument because I don't know much about the horror genre's history.

As for 'The Keep', I think I saw a copy here or there in stores. Though this is more because some of the stores really stock old stuff. http://www.sffworld.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Will check the recommendations out, folks.