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KatG
April 24th, 2012, 10:12 PM
So it was Episode #4 that turned out to be the set-up episode, whereas Episode #3 had more forward movement, but it was an excellent set-up episode for the most part.

1) Opening: best "there was a big battle but we're not going to show it because we can't afford it" technique they've done so far. Also filled the direwolf quota dosage for the night.

2) Florence Nightingale does indeed seem to be Jeyne, Rob's love interest for the arc they're going to give him. They did give her a lovely speech, and the amputation scene was fun (kudos to the guy who played the poor soldier,) but this is again part of the "I'm resigned" situation where they are leaning into making good, scrappy girls and bad scheming girls. So yeah, in part the scene fell flat. It felt like a bit from another story shoved into this one. On the other hand, Richard Madden looks cute when he's playing flustered.

3) Far more unnecessary was the Joffrey tortures prostitutes scene. It's not off book that much as I vaguely remember mention that Joffrey tears up a prostitute in the book, but at this point again they really don't need to spend time re-emphasizing in the series that Joffrey is messed up and also furiously fighting with Tyrion. I am by now heartily sick of the prostitutes and would be happy not to see any more of them, after having defended their inclusion in Season 1. They've been over-used as a device this season and as Loerwyn points out, that means other, actual minor characters in the growing story get short-shifted. This isn't Deadwood they're doing. (Not that I didn't love Deadwood.)

4) I was completely astonished to hear that the Mountain was in Harrenhal. Then it was like, oh yeah, was that guy the Mountain? So I'm also sorry that they had to recast as the first guy was perfect. I'll better judge the new guy later now that I know what I'm actually looking at. They should have had someone call him the Mountain, so we'd know. It was also odd to have Davos called the Onion Knight without any explanation of the name.

Other than that, and a mild sigh over the way they're making the actress play Melissandre, the episode was very good in its bits and pieces and seemed determined to freak out those who haven't read the books. I got a little chill watching Arya do the list, lying in the mud in the pen. The Renly-Stannis pow-wow was great, Tywin's arrival was great, Bolton terrific in his debut, Sansa was great, Bronn was delightfully Bronn, Catelyn wonderful, Davos sublime, Danys and the Qarkians excellent though the actress needs to be a little less pouty at this point perhaps, Tyrion and Lancel a pure pleasure, and Carice van Houten gets 1000 bonus points for pulling off that birth scene, never mind the aid of CGI. Hats off to director David Petrarca for managing certainly one of the weirder episodes of the series. The next two episodes should rock with little time for brothel scenes. (But there will probably be boobies, as SNL explains. My bet's on Qark.)


I don't think Loras is scheming.

You're forgetting Season 1 where he's trying to talk Renly into a coup for the throne before Robert has even died. They've made him a bit petulant and manipulative. That's not necessarily bothersome. I don't really have a problem with Margaery being more openly manipulative either. I do have a problem with them turning her into a stereotypical scheming bad girl with her neckline to her navel. But the show is simply not going to be as nuanced as the books. It makes up for it with the shocking visuals.


Tyrion is *definitely* the most honourable character in the series.

You mean, Tyrion the rapist?


Was it just me, or did Davos seem a tad underwhelmed when Melissandre gave birth to her "shadow?"

His stumbled scrambling and collapsing against the cave wall as if he was about to faint seemed underwhelmed? :)

Evil Agent
April 25th, 2012, 02:50 AM
They should have had someone call him the MountainThey did. Hot Pie: "That's him, the one who picks!" Arya (recognizing him): "The Mountain!". Later, she adds his name to her death list. Brief, but it was there. Personally, I think he looks too skinny... but his face is okay, and his voice was actually pretty cool. I just wish he wasn't wearing Lannister armour (crimson cloak and one of those stupid Lannister helmets). He looked like just another Lannister guard. IMO, that's why some people didn't recognize that he was supposed to be the Mountain.

saintjon
April 25th, 2012, 06:30 AM
Oh, Hell. My feelings have been re-horribled. I mean, she was a good strong character at first glance, and certainly worth glancing at, but I don't think it's overstating it to describe the whole Jeyne business as pivotal. Where are they going? Unless she IS Jeyne, playing at being a sparky rebellious free spirit on the battlefield, in which case I'm going to fly to the States and slap the person who decide to do turn her into such a dismal archetype. Slap them good.

Say it, man.

My thoughts exactly, EA.

Spears&Buckler
April 25th, 2012, 06:52 AM
You mean, Tyrion the rapist?



I'm sorry to go off topic, and double-sorry that I need to ask this question. Who did Tyrion rape? I've only read through A Storm of Swords, and I can't for the life of me remember this.

saintjon
April 25th, 2012, 06:54 AM
Perhaps he made a joke about raping someone that got taken the wrong way?

Loerwyn
April 25th, 2012, 06:56 AM
2) Florence Nightingale does indeed seem to be Jeyne, Rob's love interest for the arc they're going to give him. They did give her a lovely speech, and the amputation scene was fun (kudos to the guy who played the poor soldier,) but this is again part of the "I'm resigned" situation where they are leaning into making good, scrappy girls and bad scheming girls. So yeah, in part the scene fell flat. It felt like a bit from another story shoved into this one.
I didn't think she was in either category. She had a slightly dark streak due to the nature of her job, but I don't think she was necessarily "scrappy", nor bad/scheming. She was just doing her job, and made Rob(b) think about the human cost.


You mean, Tyrion the rapist?
Well, as that's not happened yet, I wouldn't really know. You know I've not read the books ;)

DailyRich
April 25th, 2012, 10:26 AM
I could easily see Talisa being Jeyne. Jeyne's the daughter of a noble, albeit a minor one. And nobles' daughters simply don't go off and be nursemaids in wartime. So she's out there under an assumed name so no one ships her back to Daddy for her own safety. I can see Robb falling for her but knowing he can't do anything about it because he thinks she's a commoner. "Well, actually Lord Stark..." That gives her a little more background than just some girl who tended Robb's wounds that he later slept with.

Palfrey
April 25th, 2012, 11:37 AM
I could easily see Talisa being Jeyne.

I think so too. She said she was from Volantis but she didn't have an accent, which so far all the foreigners have had. Plus I don't see them spending that amount of time on a meaningless scene.

murf99
April 25th, 2012, 07:52 PM
I think she's definitely Jeyne.

Who did Tyrion rape? I've read all the books and some of them twice and I can't recall this.

Evil Agent
April 25th, 2012, 08:46 PM
Tyrion "joined in" on the gang rape of Tysha, his wife. After Tywin gave her to his guards, he "made" Tyrion go last. The guards all paid her with silver coins, Tyrion paid her with a gold one.

This part of the story was left out of the show.

Lastly, why are people in this thread if they haven't read the books? This is the spoiler thread, with spoilers for ALL the books. Beware!