[hclark]

Originally posted by Crysania
Then do yourself a favor and steer clear of George R.R. Martin.

Thanks for the advice! I have so far, but its nice to have someone confirm my suspicions that he's an author I wouldn't likely enjoy.

[Hereford Eye]

Originally posted by kegasaurus
Warning
Thomas Covenant has been taught to deny life, to survive he has to close himself to everything thats out there htat remotely makes us human. His robotic checks of himself, the hospital sterility that surrounds him in his house. The simple things that make us what we are, are taken from him, the love, respect and passion that hwe take for granted, and Covenant most likely did before his illness.

Insert a "yeah, but....." please. LFB opens with TC attempting to not let the world close him off by walking to town to complain about a bill. He does not want to be apart from the world so that should not be an excuse for his insensitivity. When he gets what he has most missed, the acceptance of his fellow creatures, the lashing out reaction is not quite so defensible.


Originally posted by kegasaurus
Warning I believe the books are a powerful statement of the value of life and no matter the circumstances we should always, as Monty Python put it, Always look on the bright side of life. Celebrate waht we are, what we've been and what we are to become

I lift a glass to your summary; it is the message I came away with though..... .

[Stor-All]

Ok. I finally finished reading all of the posts. I actually printed them out and took them to read in bed before I fell asleep last night :D
Anyways, my opinion on the book changed quite a bit from when I first started it, to the middle, to the end, to now. I really liked the book when I first started...there wasn't really much action - which is what I go for - and I'm speaking of the parts before TC goes to the Land - but learning about the way Covenant though was quite entertaining. I have to admit that I did and still do have quite a dislike of his character, but in a good way...if that makes any sense. Towards the middle to second-third of the book however, the constant talk about how Covenant thought and how he was just generally angry, even though the Land had taken away his leprosy, started to get to me. I understand how it could have made him angry when the thing he had finally almost learned to live with was taken away from him, but after that initial reaction I think he would have been a little happier. I can't remember any real scene of "joy" in the book. That sort of made me feel like TC was as real as he could have been, although like someone stated earlier, if you haven't been in a similar situation you probably won't get it - and I haven't been in a similar situation so I probably don't get it fully. But then I got back into the book towards the end of it. I'm not really sure what brought me back into the book, but I really started enjoying it. I really liked the chapter(s) when the party is running from the mountain after they got the Staff of Law with all the ur-viles/cavewights following. I will freely admit that when...Bannor was it?... threw his staff and made that huge X in the tunnel so the enemy couldn't cross I said outloud "What? That's incredible!" And now my opinion has changed even more since I've read all of these posts. I feel I understand the book more and the chracter of Thomas Covenant so I can now more fully appreciate the book.
I plan to go out and get the second and third books in the series soon.

[Eventine]

Do it Stor-All - the action improves, I think you'll find more of what you like about the series, and Covenant's source of anguish does change (albeit slightly).

And if you can deal with that, I'd also suggest having a look at his Gap series. I don't really read SF - Dune, some John Wyndham, and the Gap books, which are gritty, violent, action packed and just as well written.

[onions]

Thank you, everyone, for introducing me to this series!
After I read your comments, I got so eager to start, that I actually looked for the Chronicles in London (I live in Austria).
I loved every minute of LFB.

Never have I read a fantasy book in which the author was able to so lucidly describe both nature and the psychology of his characters. He's equal to Tolkien in his atmospheric and historic depth and equal to Pat Barker ("Regeneration"- not a fantasy book but a historic one) in psychology.
At ever sentence of the book I knew exactly what he meant. What's more, I found I could understand Covenant, even though he's a brickheaded git.

Covenant rapes Lena because he knows that if he learns to believe in the healthy Land, he will be devastated if he loses it again. He wants to destroy and demean it before his desire for it destroys him.
Someone said it is strange that he never thinks of Lena again. It's not strange, there is clear evidence that he is repressing all memories about her. For instance, when he hears a snatch of her song again, he thinks "hey, I've heard that before somewhere", as if he had clean forgotten her. Such forgetting is only possible when done on purpose by the subconscious to save the mind from pain.
He rejects the plea of saving the Land because he thinks he will destroy it, like Kevin. And perversely, he loves the Land's beauty so much, that this petrifies him.
He cannot accept offerings of friendship, because he feels they are not given to him but to the legendary hero he will never be. They all think he's brave and good, but he isn't. They don't respect him as he really is, that's why he can't accept their respect.

I am surprised that a male author could describe tenderness (for instance between Mhoram and Covenant) in such a way that it never got embarassing.
And I feel quite differently from hclark: The bits where Covenant is in the real world are almost more interesting for me than the fantasy bits.

Onions

[Ladijen]

Very well said, Onions!

[kegasaurus]

Something else I probably should have put in my first post was that leprosy is all that Covenant has. Its taken the place of his family, his work and is now the thing that makes Covenant, Covenant.

This is the reason, I believe, that when he enters the land and realises that it is missing, or taken from him, thta he lashes out like he does. It is the pent up frustration of everything else that is gone, manifesting itself into the leprosy which is also taken from him.

[Eventine]

And without leprosy, he has nothing to ground himself on, and he's a hollow fragment of a man.

[Cadfael]

Well said Eventine! He has no option but to ground himself on his leprosy... he will not survive otherwise. Ending up in The Land was the ultimate irony for Covenant.

[onions]

Guys, you might want to look at this interesting "games theory" approach to TC. Plus, there's some interesting games mentioned I've never even heard about:

http://kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu/~kamikaze/documents/covenant.html

Onions