I had thought I would start this thread for those who have seen the movie, and wish to discuss it.
So, if you are viewing this message, haven't seen the movie, and you don't wish it ruined for youself, STOP READING! :)
Though, for those who want to discuss the movie, please just add the usual *SPOILER* warning in case a innocent bystander drops in by mistake. :)
December 19th, 2002, 03:32 PM
Really liked the movie. I would have liked it more if i hadn't read it. They changed a lot of things from the books.
I hated the facts that elves saved the day at the Battle of Helm's Deep.
December 19th, 2002, 07:56 PM
In case you didn't read the above- SPOILER ALERT- you have been warned
Lemme see... where to start
I thought the film was above average (7 out of 10), but not as good as the fellowship. The pacing could have been a little better, especially at the beginning. Also, a few too many lapses here and there
Opening- gandalf fighting Balrog - I think the effects dept. could have done this one a little better and made it clearer. The actual fight scene seemed like gandalf stabbing the thing a few times with not much else to it. Wasn't impressed with the clarity of the fight on screen.
Next 10 mins or so before the ent seemed dull to me. The book with the conflict between the Uruk Hai and the orcs told it better than that. Also some of the accents on those orcs were questionable. With all the effort to do elvish properly, I reckon if they'd done it in orkish/perverted elvish, it'd have been so much better. The fear of the orcs wasn't there
the ent kinda reminds me of one thing I wasn't so enthusiastic about- the more overt special effects that were used compared to the fellowship. The ent looked a tad too cgiy for my tastes. Also stuff like the wargs, and the ringwraith's mounts through the film seemed a tad too OTT for me- (then again I always though the best effects were the subtle ones you didn't see). And with the thousands of Uruk Hai, I was thinking- omg- the've got CGIitis just like episode 1 and 2 of that lucas film (then again, fellowship achived much by set design etc that couldn't have been applied to this film)
Didn't like the ringwraith attack on Gondor at the end- the wraiths were far better at generating fear. The fear was there in the marshes, but not over gondor- better plotting needed there
Helm's deep and the battle scene was really good. The sense of desperation was really well played - though Legolas' outburst seemed abrupt, and I'd have thought with his normally cool and calm manner in the first film, he'd have sought counsel with Aragorn and Gimli in private, not sounding desperate in front of the entire army. One thing- Gimli suddenly comes out with "these are not just orcs they are uruk-hai or something similar" Since when did his character come into contact with that info? Ok he fought them, but to know race names etc coined by the enemy- he's working for Saruman I'm telling you!
Gollum was extremely well fleshed out as a character, and his effects were very well done. You actually felt for his plight during the film, which cannot be overstated
Gandalf really shone (quite literally)
And gimli actually stole the show (unlike legolas and his bow last time)- yay
The elf bit was a bit boring IMHO. And there was no need to go back to the Arwen- Aragorn romance. That just seemed to be mashed in there to prolong the film, and to give liv tyler a showing- should have gone in the extended edition of the fellowship instead. In the time used, it may have been wiser to put more emphasis on Eowin and why she fancies the pants off aragorn. She doesn't show up much, but when she does, Miranda Otto does make the most of a 'relegated to smallish part so the bvattle could be fitted in'.
Eomer is hardly mentioned during the film- seemed used for about the correct length of time though to be honest.
The Faramir taking Sam and frodo to Gondor was a good diversion from the book- one thing though- if you found the ring of power was with one of your captives, wouldn't you take it away from them to prevent things going wrong? Wasn't convinced by the way Faramir let them go at the end either. Faramir was well acted though- different character to the book
Think Elijah wood is doing a great job as frodo - seems like the character is reacting correctly etc, even though the plot has changed, and it's hard to tell that it's an actor playing a part, which is the whole point.
Merry and Pippin did well. Liked the cunning playing of the ents that took place on screen.
Wormtongue was creepy as he should be
Wasn't too happy with the emphasis on the added genocide aspect of the film
And another thing- not fond of this spinning camera surveying the landscapes- they pan the thing uncomfortably fast- a good pan would involve moving at the same speed/ever so slightly faster than you'd turn your head when looking around
Liked the setup at the end of the film, leading into the third.
December 20th, 2002, 07:51 AM
I saw this last night. Overall an impressive attempt. It seemed a bit disjointed in places for me. I was trying to remember if there were elves at Helms deep (I need to re-read the book again).
I liked the protrayal of gollum - but he was causing much laughter in the cinema when he was debating with his personalities. My son felt that this took something away from the character. I loved the way they dealt with him though.
Massed medieval style battles are always difficult to stage. This looked epic but lacked any real bite for me. The final charge down a 60 degree slope when out numbered 5 to 1 didn't work for me at all. I didn't like the Osgalith (sp) bit at all.
Faramirs motives and his relationship with his father and brother could have been explored in more depth.
December 20th, 2002, 08:06 AM
I saw the movie last night. Overall, I liked it, but not quite as much as tFotR.
Oddly enough, my least favorite part was Helm's Deep. The elves were totally unnecessary. Also, I didn't like the witty banter between Legolas and Gimli. Do you remember Legolas jumping on the shield and slidding down the stairs? :rolleyes:
I also, thought the scenes with Aragorn and Arwen were overdone. Maybe a short flashback when Eowyn was asking about 'the other lady' would have sufficed.
My favorite scenes were the ones with Gollum, Frodo, and Sam. What else can I say about Gollum? To me, he was so realistic looking he scared me.
Also, I liked the scenes with the Ents, especially when they destroyed Isengard.
And, lastly, I loved the parts with Theoden, Wormtounge, Eowyn, etc. The whole Theoden/Wormtounge thing stayed pretty close to the book.
I'd give it a B grade.
December 22nd, 2002, 05:11 PM
I'm giving TTT the thumbs up for now.
It was always going to be difficult to top the high standards set in tFotR. Add to that the difficulty of juggling three different plot threads and Peter Jackson and co. had a hard act to follow.
The movie diverges much more from the book than tFotR movie. Most of this was understandable as book and film are different media and need to be treated as such. However, I remain unconvinced that the changes are all for the better. My final judgement will have to wait until The Return of the King. Only then will we be able to judge if the changes from the book have been successful.
Changes I feel dubious about: <Spoilers> follow:
I really didn't like the the Lorien elves at Helm's Deep.
Faramir, in the book a much more noble and honourable man than Boromir is now no different from his brother.
Frodo and Sam actually arrive in Osgiliath before setting off for Mordor.
It takes a 'trick' by Merry and Pippin to get the Ents to join the war and attack Isengard.
Aragorn falls off a cliff, missing presumed dead, which kicks off more laboured scenes of the relationship between Arwen and Aragorn.
Some polishing of the CGI stuff at Helm's Deep is needed. Am I the only one who noticed that during the cavalry charge out of Helm's Deep, a horse went 'through' an Uruk-hai?
On the other hand,
Gollum was a triumph (Best Acting by a CGI character?)
The Ents were neat as was Gandalf's battle with the Balrog.
Gimli the comic-relief actually worked, bringing a much needed lightness amidst the darkness of Helm's Deep. Actually, the whole Helm's Deep sequence was mindblowing.
Roll on The Return of The King.
December 22nd, 2002, 05:59 PM
The Two Towers.
From the opening vista of the Misty Mountains, to Gollum leading The Ringbearer to Minas Morgul at the end, The Two Towers is bursting with beauty and action from every scene, every pixel.
It is a masterpiece.
Jackson is quoted as saying it is the film which differs most from the books, it is, but remains a remarkably faithful adaptation, with the essence of the characters and story all intact.
The acting again was superb. Impossible to pick out the best, but I will try. McKellen, wonderful again as Gandalf, the scene where he enters Meduseld, the Halls of Theodon was fantastic. All the Hobbits again well acted, Astin and Wood with great performance. Orlando Bloom is actually an elf. And Viggo, well he goes from strength to strength as Aragorn.
It begins with sweeping strings, and an awe inspiring pan of the Misty Mountains, blending into Gandalf’s battle with the Balrog, with Gandalf smiting the Demon upon the mountainside. That which could not be improved upon, was just getting better!
Merry and Pippins journey into Fangorn, and meeting the Ents was magical. I, like many, was worried about how the Ents would come over onscreen. The Last march of the Ents to Isengard was well done, and the real ancient atmosphere of Fangorn Forest was well done.
The land of Rohan was also excellently brought to life, and the characters introduced were again superbly acted, with Bernard Hill as Theodon being the notable standout. His, “Where is the Horse and the Rider, Where is the Horn that was blowing?” speech was stirring stuff. I especially liked the development of the relationships between Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli. The most memorable scene in the film, was one of the most subtle. When Aragorn arrives at Helms Deep, after being thought dead, Gimli and others greet him with enthusiasm. But watch when he meets Legolas, he simply remarks Aragorn is late, and silently hands him The Evenstar. It is The Evenstar, and the love which encompasses it, which gave Ellesar the strength to resist the temptation of The Ring, it is his precious. Legolas knew this and ensured its return to Aragorn.
Gollum. Jackson’s most difficult task in this film was to create a believable Gollum. To capture the longing and suffering, the need and the emptiness, the cruelty and deceit, the pity. Gollum was all this and more.
There is so much to this film it definitely needs repeat viewings, and keeps getting better. I seen it twice on the opening day, and several more viewings are planned. The release of The Two Towers now finishes the task that Fellowship had started. I never thought I would say this, but we have now seen an eclipse of a Star. Star Wars is usurped. It was once said that Return of The Jedi was a weak film in an excellent series. Now it is more accurate to say New Hope and Empire Strikes Back were excellent films in a weak series. The Lord of The Rings is Star Wars for the new millennium, and the new King of motion picture history will be crowned next year. Long live Ellesar Telcontar.
December 22nd, 2002, 07:52 PM
It was fantastic, at the beginning it felt somewhat shaky as I hadn't watched Fellowship in a while but it took off and grasped me very quickly. They made more changes in story outlined in the book then they did in the first movie but it was probably for the best because it came out pretty near perfect! Gollum was awesomea especially his dual personality chats!
"We must kill the hobbitsses!"
"No, we mustn't!"
If you haven't seen it smack yourself across the face and go see it now!
Hello Stewart! As there's already a thread about the Two towers I've merged yours with the older thread. Hobbit
December 22nd, 2002, 11:09 PM
Too bad the books weren't as good as Two Towers. (Yes Sammie, I actually went to see it.)
December 23rd, 2002, 10:52 PM
Although I wasn't thrilled with some of the additions to the storyline (such as Sam and Frodo's detour to Osgiliath) all in all I really enjoyed the movie. It was not only visually stunning (Eomer's helmet looked so cool) but I felt that the acting was quite good. Elijah Wood and Sean Astin were great in my opinion.
I am utterly impressed with the job they did on Gollum--what facial expressions he had! And the Ents also were fabulous. The scene where they are destroying Isengard was my favourite. Whoever designed what the Ents would look like, I would like to give a pat on the back. They were just how I always imagined them. I loved especially the way their feet looked like roots and sort of sunk into the ground with every step. Good stuff!
I had a few trifling complaints but in general I thought it was a great movie and when it was over I didn't feel like three hours had already passed.