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August 6th, 2004, 02:31 PM
Okay, I am going to see if this thread will be a long lasting one.
The idea is for Writers to be able to post something they dont know what it is called and someone else could try to help them.

Example: What is that weapon used a long time ago that was a spiked ball on the end of the chain? Answer: a Flail.


My questions are: What are them hats called that Gardening Women wear that looks like it is made of straw. And if you dont have a clue then I will also say Gandolf is wearing it at the beginning of LOTR: The Fellow Ship.

August 6th, 2004, 05:27 PM
I think you're just looking for a "straw hat". They're made in many different styles.

You can find some here. (http://www.villagehatshop.com/vhs_womens_straw.html)

August 7th, 2004, 07:01 PM
BTW - I believe what you called a flail (unless I'm mistaken) is also called a mace or a Morningstar

(and if you read David Gemmell's book, "Morningstar" he uses that as a kind of play on words as the main character is called Jerek Mace) {end of trivial information} :rolleyes:

I'm trying to think of some things that I'm not sure what the term is... I'll have to post in the morning - it's very late here...


August 8th, 2004, 08:36 AM
Actually FF I don't think mace and morning-star are synonyms. A mace is a crushing weapon with either a heavy bulbous, or spiked head mounted atop a shaft. They are an advancement upon the even more primitive club, but still wielded in largely the same way either on foot or from horseback. You are quite correct in pointing up that what Sub-Zero was originally referring to is indeed more properly called a morning-star; which is understood to be descended from the mace. A flail by contrast is a rather generic term, related presumably to it's original agricultural function and need not have a spiked ball afixed to the end. 'Flail' can also be used to refer to a modification upon the morning-star whereby, rather than one spiked ball being attached, three are.

Still on a pedantic note you should really be more careful when writing about Tolkien on this forum Sub. Gandalf, not Gandolf. Nor is it the "Fellow Ship," since it is not about a Ship of Fellows but rather the 'Fellowship' since it is about a group of companions and their camraderie (and may also advert to a more theological twist, depending on whether you subscribe to such theories about Professor Tolkien's purposes).

I can certainly see the value in this thread. However if you are going to provide information then you should at least make absolutely sure that it is accurate.

August 8th, 2004, 09:29 AM
...and a Morningstar is swung around on a chain. I'm assuming that both could do a pretty good job of knocking one's head off, oh pedantic one! ;) Seriously, I would guess that the Morning Star would be more labour intensive to make due to the chain, whereas you could knock up a mace out of some wood and anything sharp - much more primative eh?

BTW Darknel - are you in Dunedin in Scotland?
FYI Sub is only 12 so you *might* want to cut him a wee bit of slack! He shows great enthusiasm for the genre and we do like so get them young, y'know...

All best

ironchef texmex
August 8th, 2004, 10:01 AM
Sniff, sniff, do I smell pedantry? :D

Back in college, my military history prof (God, I loved that class!) said that morning stars were primarily ornamental, good for wall decorations, but almost never used on actual battlefields. Apparently their was some sort of problem with that chained ball swinging where it wasn't supposed to and hitting the user/ comrades/ your horse/ the peasant you were supposed to be rescuing/ etc.

Hey Sub, about your original question my Grandma calls her straw hat a sun hat. I've also heard it called a garden hat.

August 8th, 2004, 11:14 AM
Straw hats are worn because they're light, offers some shade and are usually airy. They're best in Summer in the heat. So maybe you're looking at a summer hat, a sun hat, a garden hat, a beech hat, a farmer's hat or a straw hat.

But I've seen cloth garden hats and sun hats too. They're generic terms.

As for a flail, wasn't those suppose to be used on horseback so you could reach the enemy?

ironchef texmex
August 8th, 2004, 11:28 AM
As for a flail, wasn't those suppose to be used on horseback so you could reach the enemy?

My old D&D book has both a horseman and a footman's flails. The difference being that the horseman's flail had a much longer chain. It also set you back a few more gp. :D

August 8th, 2004, 07:26 PM
Okay, apologies if I sounded a little harsh earlier. 12. Wow!
I do think this is a very worthwhile thread. My own area of difficulty for coming up with correct terms is in the architectural sphere. Just what is a flying buttress anyway?

Yes FF that would be Dunedin, Scotland. Glorious capital of our nation betrayed.

Still, at least we've got the Book Festival coming up :)
I assume from "SE Scotland" you live in the vicinity?

ironchef texmex
August 8th, 2004, 08:16 PM
My own area of difficulty for coming up with correct terms is in the architectural sphere. Just what is a flying buttress anyway?

A buttress is a stone structure, usually repeated, that holds up a wall from the outside. They have them on many of the cathedrals up around your parts. A flat buttress looks like a triangle of stone that has been pressed against the outside of a wall or building. If the center of the buttress is hollow they call it a flying buttress. So walk around a the outside of a cathedral. Walk up next to the wall. If all those stone protrusions make you walk around them then they're flat buttresses. If they look like a pillar that has been raised to the wall at a 45 degree angle and you can walk underneath them, then they are "flying".