Dune

[NilsDesperandum]

I can't recall Godmakers now, but it is in my library somewhere. Will have to dig it out sometime!

One that is extremely hard going is Destination: Void. Good concept - the skeleton crew of a sleeper spaceship attempting to activate a consciousness that will succesfully steer them to their destination. Problem is the 'minds' keep going mad. Unfortunately it gets very bogged down in the technicalities.

The Jesus Incident is a semi-sequel to the above and is more 'Dune-like' in style. It is Herbert's attempt to create another world, this time a watery one, on the same scale as Arrakis. It doesn't come close to those heights, but its definately not a bad read. There are two further follow ups which I think are called The Ascension Factor and The Lazarus Effect . The three of them were co-written with Bill Ransom, but the last one was penned almost entirely by Ransom as Herbert passed away having got no further than the outline.

Two more good Herbert reads:

The Dosadi Experiment and Whipping Star which both feature the author's favourite charachter, Saboteur Extraordinary Jorj X. McKie.

ND

[psikeyhackr]

Then....

Now I am confused!

ND

OK, we are dealing with short posts on a message board.

In another post I also said:

I liked Dune when I first read it. I kind of doubt I would like it as much today. Really long stories with heavy emphasis on the culture and atmosphere don't interest me so much anymore.

psik

[kater]

I have never found it necessary to read any of the sequels even though I liked the novel. I don't really like the idea of sequels.

You know I felt the same way for a long time about the first three books, I couldn't get beyond that 'ending' as such and God Emperor didn't appeal even though I owned the next few books. Start of this year I went back to Dune and ended up reading every one of the Frank Herbert written books and was incredibly (I don't over use the word I hope) surprised by how strong the other novels are. Dune is still my favourite but now it's a very close thing. I understand where your sentiment comes from but I'd be remiss in not suggesting just having a look at the next few books, they really changed my way of looking at Dune and though very different it is still quality Frank Herbert writing, which is better than 99% of sf

[psikeyhackr]

Then....

Now I am confused!

ND

OK, we are dealing with short posts on a message board.

In another post I also said:

I liked Dune when I first read it. I kind of doubt I would like it as much today. Really long stories with heavy emphasis on the culture and atmosphere don't interest me so much anymore.

I suppose I could put that still another way. Since one of the reasons I want to promote science fiction is to encourage children's interest in and knowledge of science I could evaluate DUNE on that basis. So I would have to say DUNE is nearly crap from that perspective.

So I guess we have at least 4 separate factors

Science / Ideas / Story quality / Literary quality.

I have mentioned before that Mack Reynolds is one of the worst writers that I still like. Although I consider the literary quality of Dune superior to R-Master by Reynolds I would be more inclined to encourage grade school kids to read Reynolds.

I think story quality and literary quality are very subjective and a matter of taste so there can be lots of disagreement about that and finding what is "GOOD" means finding people who's tastes agree with yours. I bought Revelation Space because a website said it was good but I couldn't stand it. I have decided I'm going to finish it anyway, I'm currently stopped about 80 pages from the end, but I'll finish it to write about it some time.

I just think we need an evaluation system that makes it easier for people to find stuff they like. I think overall that would make for increased readership and consumption.

psik

[ArthurFrayn]

I understand where your sentiment comes from but I'd be remiss in not suggesting just having a look at the next few books, they really changed my way of looking at Dune and though very different it is still quality Frank Herbert writing, which is better than 99% of sf

Thanks ; your enthusiastic recommendation is noted.
Actually I have all the sequels and after seeing the Children of Dune TV movie, I've considered finally sitting down and reading at least a few of the sequels. So as of now, I'm entertaining that notion for next years reading.

[Colonel Worf]

I've read Dune, Dune Messiah, and Children of Dune along with Whipping Star by Frank Herbert. He really is a good storyteller.

[Chipacabra]

When I first read Dune, in high school, I found it to be intriguing and incredibly turgid. I was also turned off by the omnicient viewpoint; it was easy to follow but I really didn't like the way the story kept jumping into everyone's heads...it was like reading a play in which the actors don't know to shut up. In later years, I re-read Dune and found it to be intriguing, quite nice, actually, and not quite as turgid as I'd first imagined. I've grown into a deep appreciation of Dune now...as well as the sequels (penned by Frank Herbert himself.) I can't say whether or not Dune itself ranks as highly on my list as it might on someone else's, but I will say that it's worthy of the praise that it gets. To be honest, I much prefer the later books in the series, especially Heretics of Dune and Chapterhouse: Dune...for me, those seem like a reboot of the series, though they're more of a natural evolution I think. Dune and its series exists close to my heart. As Frank Herbert didn't pen the "prequels" and "continuations" himself, I don't count those as parts of the official Dune cannon. Frank Herbert may have left notes, but he most certainly did not write those stories!

[DDCOrange]

I actually liked the Dune movie directed by Lynch. The portrayal of the Baron Harkonnen by Kenneth McMillan was spot on. Costumes and set design were also amazing. Though acting by Sean Young and Kyle MacLachlan were pretty bad IMO.

About the first 40 minutes of the movie was quite good. In spite of some spotty acting here and there the lavish sets, costumes and effects (impressive considering that it was made in 1984) at least captured the spirit of the novel and kept me interested. Then somewhere in the middle it seemed like the production ran out of money and the second half felt cheap, rushed and tacked together (you could almost hear the studio exec. screaming "finish the damn thing already!"). Of course part of the problem was simply that the story both conceptually and literally was too big to fit in a feature length film. I did like the portrayal of the whole Harkonnen clan which personified evil.
I think the main reason the film tanked was because too many people in the audience never read the book and faced and overwelming array of new concepts to absorb at once rending them utterly clueless. The public reaction was much like my poor wife (who never read the book) "WTF just happened?"