SoT - Legend of the Seeker

**kirk** · August 25th, 2010, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by Roland 85

Andolis, would you be kind enough to name a few "mid tier" fantasy writers that Goodkind is superior to?

teahupoo, you are hilarious. Although, not for the reasons you think, I fear ^_^

Don't know about the mid tier part, but Sanderson to Goodkind is like Spiderman comics to Gene Wolfe.

But, no really, there's not a whole lot of fantasy that's much worse than that.

**nquixote** · August 25th, 2010, 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by teahupoo

What makes Sword of Truth bad?

1. He kills off or cripples all your favorite characters in the first book.

2. Graphic depictions of rape and incest.

3. 8 year old girl trains and becomes a ninja by running around on her tippy toes and chasing cats.

4 16 year old boy becomes the best war strategist and general alive, with zero experience.

5. 16 year old run away, naive, virgin princes, becomes a sultry super sex wife to some 12 ft' horse demon.

6. 16 year old virgin, sultry, sex princess gives birth to her baby dragons and takes over the continent that she fled to.

7. A witty dwarf. <-- i actually like him

8. The book's odd preoccupation with winter and cold.

9. The whole story being a complete rip-off from war of the roses.

10. Total and complete lack of a hero. There were a couple possibilities, but they're all dead now. Seriously, who is the hero?

Wait, I might be thinking of a different book.

I have GOT to get me this book.

**teahupoo** · August 25th, 2010, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by kirk

So you just picked a random thread to bash ASOIAF? I must admit though, a remarkable troll attempt. A whole 10 point list with a sentence before and after. Is it as much fun as you thought it was going to be?

Sorry, I didn't know this was strictly a bash Sword of Truth thread . Is turnabout not fair play? But, since you pointed out it's just a "random thread" i apologize.

To be honest i like ASoIaF, I just think it's funny how people get down on Terry Goodkind because his "Fantasy" is too fantasy (I know Terry said he doesn't write fantasy) but, when i point out some fanciful things from everyone's favorite author you all get bent out of shape.

I am not a troll, I am just stating my opinion.

**Roland 85** · August 25th, 2010, 11:46 PM

Uh, no, people get down on Terry Goodkind because he is retarded, pretentious, full of **** AND a terrible writer ^_^ At the same time, Martin has arguably the best characterisation and style in the entire genre, which KIND OF compensates for any lapses in logic your obviously keen eye has spotted.

**Gizmo** · August 26th, 2010, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by Roland 85

Uh, no, people get down on Terry Goodkind because he is retarded, pretentious, full of **** AND a terrible writer ^_^ At the same time, Martin has arguably the best characterisation and style in the entire genre, which KIND OF compensates for any lapses in logic your obviously keen eye has spotted.

The type of anti-goodkind fan that you clearly are, I really wouldn't be calling others pretentious.

@bolded: in your opinion.

**Gizmo** · August 26th, 2010, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by nquixote

Actually, I'm not assuming that. It's more fun to think that SoT fans are just sucky suckheads.

You seem like one of those people who really denigrate Goodkind fans and immediately pigeonhole them as having 'bad taste' or being 'clueless'. I may be wrong, maybe you're just been playful. But those type of people generally tend to be quite sad.

**Shayna** · August 26th, 2010, 10:24 AM

Look everybody...just enjoy the books and enjoy the show! They are both here to entertain us.

Different choices... isn't that why we love books?? To try a great variety of flavours!!

have fun reading!! Shayna

**Andols** · August 26th, 2010, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by Gizmo

You seem like one of those people who really denigrate Goodkind fans and immediately pigeonhole them as having 'bad taste' or being 'clueless'. I may be wrong, maybe you're just been playful. But those type of people generally tend to be quite sad.

He's just being flippant. He thinks he's more flippant than I am but he's just to sucky to realize the level of suck he has obtained.

And to Roland, i'd lump Goodkind in with Modesitt, peirs anthony, david drake, Eddings, 1/2 of terry brooks, probably a few others im forgetting.

I'm not saying he's better than them but I do consider them to all belong in each others company in terms of their fantasy works.

**Andols** · August 26th, 2010, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by Shayna

Look everybody...just enjoy the books and enjoy the show! They are both here to entertain us.

Different choices... isn't that why we love books?? To try a great variety of flavours!!

have fun reading!! Shayna

all lies. people should like the books that i like or stop reading.

**kirk** · August 26th, 2010, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by Gizmo

You seem like one of those people who really denigrate Goodkind fans and immediately pigeonhole them as having 'bad taste' or being 'clueless'. I may be wrong, maybe you're just been playful. But those type of people generally tend to be quite sad.

Aren't you doing the same thing? I firmly believe I can do both: think other people's tastes are awful and be a happy person.

Also I don't think he was playful at all, that was said very seriously.

**Gizmo** · August 26th, 2010, 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by kirk

Aren't you doing the same thing? I firmly believe I can do both: think other people's tastes are awful and be a happy person.

Also I don't think he was playful at all, that was said very seriously.

Obviously not sad emotion wise, ha. And yes, i know it wasn't said particularly serious, but it is a common thought in many anti-goodkind people.

Not at all. I don't immediately pigeonhole people for liking a particular type of work. Again, maybe he doesn't either...but there are a lot of anti-goodkind/SoT people who then go on to attack or pigeonhole goodkind fans.

I'm not going to get into an argument about the merit of Goodkinds work, I've done that many a time before and I have no interest in it. I'm specifically talking about the treatment of Goodkind fans as some clueless, lesser people, which some anti-goodkind fans are capable of.

**kirk** · August 26th, 2010, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by Gizmo

I'm specifically talking about the treatment of Goodkind fans as some clueless, lesser people

What does this treatment include?

**Gizmo** · August 26th, 2010, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by kirk

What does this treatment include?

Well, the sentence implied what I meant. Generally looked down upon I guess.

**mshnd06** · August 26th, 2010, 11:42 AM

Tea
I think the "haters" (myself included) primarily object to the poor quality of the writing and the explicit and clumsy ideological moralizing. Neither of these is present in the Martin. Even fantasy novels require verisimilitude and internal coherence, and I think competence in these areas requires skill in narrative composition, characterization, world-building (relevant in the genre in which Goodkind writes, whether he admits it or no), descriptive prose and dialogue, not to mention forethought, none of which I believe Goodkind possesses. Martin, however, because of his general greater talent as a writer can incorporate implausible elements into a cogent narrative. Of course, all of this is simply my opinion. Our opinions are equally valid. It's just as irresponsible and disrespectful to write off dissenting opinions as "haters gonna hate" as it is to deride someone for a predilection for Goodkind. Some people for whom linear narrative and fast-paced plotting are a priority are going to like Goodkind. Many others that prefer depth of characterization, coherent world-building and skillful prose, may not. Please simply refrain from implying that all negative reviews are part of some insidious agenda.