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  1. #16
    I'm not going to pile on a book that was obviously a brutal struggle for an author I like very much (and reads like it). You can go elsewhere for the pile-on.

    MILD SPOILERS AHEAD


    I'll just say this: Judging by AFFC and ADWD, Martin should have gone with the fast-forward after ASOS he originally envisioned. The events of ASOS are apocalyptic, and a fast-forward would have given Martin some fresh backstory to play with -- something he does very, very well. The way the history of Robert's Rebellion is revealed (and the speculation that fills in the gaps) is one of the things that really set the first three books apart.

    With a fast-forward after ASOS, Martin could have done the same thing with the events following that book, and the exposition could have been parceled out in hints, clues, and reveals so the reader can piece it together on their own, without having to read 2,000 pages of POV characters wandering in circles, riding pigs, attending to administrative challenges, waiting for the wind to fill their sails, or buried in snowstorms.

    Also, don't call your book "A Dance with Dragons" and then chain the dragons in a pit for the duration of the book.

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Cameron Haley View Post
    I'm not going to pile on a book that was obviously a brutal struggle for an author I like very much (and reads like it). You can go elsewhere for the pile-on.

    MILD SPOILERS AHEAD


    I'll just say this: Judging by AFFC and ADWD, Martin should have gone with the fast-forward after ASOS he originally envisioned. The events of ASOS are apocalyptic, and a fast-forward would have given Martin some fresh backstory to play with -- something he does very, very well. The way the history of Robert's Rebellion is revealed (and the speculation that fills in the gaps) is one of the things that really set the first three books apart.

    With a fast-forward after ASOS, Martin could have done the same thing with the events following that book, and the exposition could have been parceled out in hints, clues, and reveals so the reader can piece it together on their own, without having to read 2,000 pages of POV characters wandering in circles, riding pigs, attending to administrative challenges, waiting for the wind to fill their sails, or buried in snowstorms.

    Also, don't call your book "A Dance with Dragons" and then chain the dragons in a pit for the duration of the book.
    Well, that's all based on the premise that a fantasy series has to be all action, all the time. Which personally I would find pretty dull. History has slow parts, too; AFFC is a wonderful picture of the chaos that follows on from a war, the attempts to reassert social stability after the realm bleeds...The first three books show us that Martin can send people to the slaughter, and the fourth shows us he can bury the dead.

    and frankly, I think more than enough happens in ADWD. The 'dance' is obviously metaphorical - the pursuit of Dany and her pets by a whole host of people for different ends quite clearly dominates the bulk of the book. In that respect it's oddly one of the most cohesive in the whole series, despite its sprawling girth. Besides which
    Spoiler:
    SHE GETS ON ONE AND FRIGGIN FLIES AROUND ON IT

    for crying out loud.

  3. #18
    I want to be a princess sic's mom's Avatar
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    I have the last five chapters to go and I have to say that I have loved the book. I am so tired of reading reviews where people are complaining about how slow this book is and how bad it is just like AFFC. Well I liked AFFC so in one sense I don't agree with these people. Yes it was a slow book, like this one is but there are plenty of things that you learn if you pay attention. And for crying out loud people we knew that this book, at least part of it was part of the book AFFC. It was all supposed to be one book. So why would it be much different from AFFC? I think people were expecting ASOS again and that just isn't going to happen. As someone else said all action all the time is boring. I enjoy the quiet moments where things happen that make you think. Yes I have enjoyed the later part of this book. It does move forward a little faster. And I am hoping that Martin can move the plot forward in the next one. Only because I hope he can tell this story in seven books like he has said.

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by tragic View Post
    Well, that's all based on the premise that a fantasy series has to be all action, all the time.
    No, it's not. It's based on the radical notion that scenes should advance the story. In any case, I'm glad you enjoyed the book.

  5. #20
    Humble Grifter Luya Sevrein's Avatar
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    I don't think they were too high at all, the writing isn't bad, the plot has always been this slow in Asoiaf books.

    It's just that general thing of when something is drawn out so much and built up, people will never be happy.

    Like when Family Guy drag on jokes so long that the punchline can never make up for it.

  6. #21
    Registered User oasis seeker's Avatar
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    I enjoyed the latest book very much. It wasn't perfect, of course, but I look at it like this:

    I regard the third book as the best (so far) because it was very climactic. The first two led up to it, making it a mini climax--kind of like an ending of the First Act (in 3 Act story.)

    So I regard the books afterward as leading up to another climactic book. Whether it'll be the sixth book that's a mini-climax like the third, or it'll be the seventh and final one that's a slam-bang climactic finale - still remains to be seen.

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Cameron Haley View Post
    No, it's not. It's based on the radical notion that scenes should advance the story. In any case, I'm glad you enjoyed the book.
    Yeah, these last two books have pretty much just been all the characters regrouping from the events of ASOS. It's a game of thrones, and the pieces have been slowly realigning in these last two books. Now it's time to play again, for real, one last time. That's not to say the last two books have been devoid of anything exciting, or that they're not good books (they are) but that's what it has felt like to me all the same. Did they have to be written? Actually, maybe not. But I definitely have enjoyed them a great deal regardless.
    Last edited by TooNice; July 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 AM.

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