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  1. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Loerwyn View Post
    And? When have reviews ever truly meant anything? Review scores are inflated, many reviews overlook criticism in lieu of drowning the book in sugary praise and they don't play up a book's issues enough.

    What I would want to see would be the more critical reviews of Rothfuss' work. I've already seen the pornokitsch review of WMF, and I'm sure there are others out there who would say Rothfuss' work is bloated tripe. Those are the reviews I want to see, because they're not blinded by fanboy-ish adoration for a guy who's put out just two books, but who is being heralded as the literary second coming of a certain beardy fellow.

    Edit: I'd like to point out that I'm not trolling nor fishing for a flame fest, but I honestly think the reviews that suggest why you shouldn't read an author or book are just as telling, if not more so, than why you should.
    How do you know that the negative reviews are a better representation of the quality of Rothfuss' books? You haven't even read them.

    And the idea that negative reviews are more legitimate than positive ones is ridiculous. Most reviews will point out positive and negative qualities of a book. Just because the positives outweigh the negatives, doesn't make them fanboys. Just because someone actually enjoys what they are reading, doesn't make them blinded. And just because someone's opinion differs from yours, doesn't make them wrong.

  2. #17
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    There is no question that I am in all the way for book 3. Book 2 was a big disappointment to me on a number of levels, but I loved book 1 enough that I would never consider not buying and reading book 3. Looking forward to it.

    Two things I won't do though...

    I won't let my love for NoTW cause me to start thinking WMF was more interesting that it was... it failed for me.

    But I also won't let my disappointment in WMF lead me to thinking Rothfuss is not a good writer with a tremendous amount of potential! NoTW showed me that.

  3. #18
    Just Another Philistine Hereford Eye's Avatar
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    I am a fan of sff, a fact easily discernible from my haunt of this website. I am also male. Combine the two and I must be a fanboy. The Lady Who Shares Her Life With Me agrees that I have never grown up and I'd concede some merit to that opinion though I have been trying to do so for damned near 7 decades. However, I am not an automatic supporter of anyone. I don't care for GRRM, Robert Jordan, Terry Goodkind. Scott Bakker, Todd McCarthy. I have the deepest respect and affection for The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings and have little use for anything that JRRT produced thereafter. I like Brian Sanderson, Barry Hughart, Kevin Radthorne, Sean Stewart, Ursula K. LeGuin. L.E. Modesitt, Jr., some Andre Norton, most CJ Cherryh, John Myers Myers, most China Mieville, and Lian Hearn.

    And I like The Name of the Wind.

  4. #19
    Registered User JustaStaffer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhallva View Post
    There is no question that I am in all the way for book 3. Book 2 was a big disappointment to me on a number of levels, but I loved book 1 enough that I would never consider not buying and reading book 3. Looking forward to it.

    Two things I won't do though...

    I won't let my love for NoTW cause me to start thinking WMF was more interesting that it was... it failed for me.

    But I also won't let my disappointment in WMF lead me to thinking Rothfuss is not a good writer with a tremendous amount of potential! NoTW showed me that.
    This. I'm definitely in this camp.

  5. #20
    Registered User Loerwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seak View Post
    Goodreads has a number of them. Look for the one star ratings and then the HUGE amount of commentary from all the people who thought they should give it 5 stars...because you can tell someone what to think.
    A lot of them will also be "I didn't like it because it sucked", but that was a good idea. That said, I want a properly structured and reasoned example of why I shouldn't read Rothfuss. If he does something that irks me, as things I've heard would suggest he has done, then I will not read his books solely for that reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bastard View Post
    There are plenty of positive reviews that are not based on fanboyism, just as there are critical reviews that are based solely on being contrarian, that they have an ax to grind against popularity for some reason particularly if for whatever reason they didn't enjoy the book. So they embellish the negativity. So focusing solely on them is just as wrong.
    I'm not focusing solely on the negative reviews, as I've only read one (Pornokitsch's review), but I'm sick of seeing wall-to-wall praise for Rothfuss and minor details on what the person didn't like about the books. The thing with positive reviews is that the negatives get pushed to the back (just as the positives get pushed to the back with a negative review), so reading both gives me a better idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    How do you know that the negative reviews are a better representation of the quality of Rothfuss' books? You haven't even read them.

    And the idea that negative reviews are more legitimate than positive ones is ridiculous. Most reviews will point out positive and negative qualities of a book. Just because the positives outweigh the negatives, doesn't make them fanboys. Just because someone actually enjoys what they are reading, doesn't make them blinded. And just because someone's opinion differs from yours, doesn't make them wrong.
    I never said any of that. I think that just as positive reviews heap praise on aspects of an author's work, a negative review is likely going to go into more detail with what was bad with it. That is what I want to know. I can't ask many people on this site what they think of his work because I will get almost nothing but praise - Some of it genuine and constructive, some of it fanboyish in "Rothfuss has written the best series ever" ways (Yes, I've seen it. No, I don't take it seriously).

    What I'm trying to say is that I want, and need, views from the other side of the fence to decide on these books. His books are what, 800+ pages long? That's a lot of time to invest in one book. I'm not going to do that freely if I don't agree with aspects of the series, such as how characters behave or if the books could be trimmed by 200+ pages. I only slogged through the 600+ pages of utter tripe that was Canavan's The High Lord because it was the end to a series and I needed to know if she could redeem the path she took the book down, for example, and I came away sorely disappointed.

    Do I have a lot of free time? Yes, but I'd rather spend it reading things I know I'll like rather than bashing my head against a wall trying to read a book about some sex-crazed 15 year old who gets more women than Ron Jeremy's career. Or, at least, that's how Kvothe's charm seems to work out as from the reviews I've seen.

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdI View Post
    LOL awards committees? Number one who cares? Hugo and WFA award winners do not impress me. Gotta be honest only cared for a handful of WFA winners that I read.
    Hey -- Get over yourself. The OP asked for opinions, and I gave mine. If you don't like it or agree with it, that's A-Okay with me.

  7. #22

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Loerwyn View Post

    Do I have a lot of free time? Yes, but I'd rather spend it reading things I know I'll like rather than bashing my head against a wall trying to read a book about some sex-crazed 15 year old who gets more women than Ron Jeremy's career. Or, at least, that's how Kvothe's charm seems to work out as from the reviews I've seen.
    I don't get where you got that impression, or why any reviewer would make it seem that Kvothe is "sex-crazed" as you describe him to be. It is simply not the case. He has sex, yes. But it isn't really a prominent part of the books. His time with Felurian is maybe a bit much, but I think that it will be important later on.

    If you want negatives on the series, there are plenty of reviews that mention them. I don't think that they are even all that hard to find. Even mostly positive reviews from Wert, Pat and Rob point out fairly big negatives.

  9. #24
    Registered User JustaStaffer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    I don't get where you got that impression, or why any reviewer would make it seem that Kvothe is "sex-crazed" as you describe him to be. It is simply not the case. He has sex, yes. But it isn't really a prominent part of the books. His time with Felurian is maybe a bit much, but I think that it will be important later on.

    If you want negatives on the series, there are plenty of reviews that mention them. I don't think that they are even all that hard to find. Even mostly positive reviews from Wert, Pat and Rob point out fairly big negatives.
    EDIT: too spoilery and thus removed.

  10. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by JustaStaffer View Post
    EDIT: too spoilery and thus removed.
    You can use spoiler tags- [*spoiler*] [*/spoiler*] without the asterisks.

  11. #26
    and I like to party. Seak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loerwyn View Post
    A lot of them will also be "I didn't like it because it sucked", but that was a good idea. That said, I want a properly structured and reasoned example of why I shouldn't read Rothfuss. If he does something that irks me, as things I've heard would suggest he has done, then I will not read his books solely for that reason.
    Here are a few. The first has 110 comments to it, which makes the review author go into even more detail.

    BTW - I loved The Name of the Wind (5 out of 5 Stars-wise love). It's style is perfect for me, slow and descriptive. I'm also a huge Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell fan though.

  12. #27
    Registered User Loerwyn's Avatar
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    Thanks, Seak. That first one had me giggling. I also read this review, and again, it plays on things I just don't care for.

    The point about bad reviews is that they focus on the bad things. I have read good reviews, and they do mention problems with the book, but I don't want to know why I should read Rothfuss, I want to know why I shouldn't. Many people here will tell you to read him, but I've never heard a single, solid reason why. Has he got a way with words? Mayhaps, and that's fine. But it doesn't matter if he's a wordsmith if he's created reprehensible characters who are thinner than a piece of tracing paper. I've heard Kvothe is a good character, but it doesn't mean anything if the situations he gets into are ridiculous and unbelievable. If what I've seen in reviews is true, then Kvothe is praised or liked for aspects of his personality (Such as his talent) that Goodkind's Richard is condemned for. That's the sort of stuff that turns me off a book.

    Again, I'm not trolling or trying to be controversial for the sake of it. I'll admit I've been tempted to buy the first book, but something holds me back.

    For those who haven't read the Pornokitsch review of TWMF, here it is.

  13. #28
    I think that there are plenty of good reasons to read Rothfuss, but not all of them will appeal to you. I think characterization and prose is what Rothfuss does best. Some might disagree on the characterization bit, but I love what he has done with Kvothe and how he has demonstrated that he is not entirely trustworthy in telling this story. I think he has also done a good job of keeping his characters consistent. So no, I wouldn't say his characters are thin at all. You mind find them reprehensible where I did not. But how does Kvothe have anything to do with Richard Rhal? I don't see a similarity (even in talent) at all.

    Other positives- an interesting magic system, well written dialog, and just generally a well written, character driven story. I'm not going to expand much past that. It isn't a talent of mine to describe why or what I enjoyed about a story. Quite simply: I just did!

    And you know how you say people overplay the positives? Your buddy in that review has done worse with the negatives. I enjoyed the short paragraph that Rothfuss did for his trip to his patron. I thought it was a great tongue in cheek, tweak the readers nose and save some space type of deal. He's also done the same with how all the characters love Kvothe. And he realizes that Kvothe is telling the story, right? And that Kvothe is probably playing up the positives and down playing his negatives? Again, it was this type of wondering that made me actually enjoy Kvothe a bit more as a character. I don't really need to say much more on that review. The negativity and hyperbole contained within it are way too much for me to take seriously. He doesn't seem to appreciate character driven stories. I have a feeling he'd fail to enjoy Guy Gavriel Kay as well.

    But no, I wouldn't recommend you do read Rothfuss. I don't think you would enjoy him. But that doesn't make him "utter tripe". There are enough positive reviews available to indicate that that isn't the case.
    Last edited by Haliax; July 28th, 2011 at 05:19 PM.

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    I think that there are plenty of good reasons to read Rothfuss, but not all of them will appeal to you. I think characterization and prose is what Rothfuss does best. Some might disagree on the characterization bit, but I love what he has done with Kvothe and how he has demonstrated that he is not entirely trustworthy in telling this story. I think he has also done a good job of keeping his characters consistent. So no, I wouldn't say his characters are thin at all. You mind find them reprehensible where I did not. But how does Kvothe have anything to do with Richard Rhal? I don't see a similarity (even in talent) at all.

    Other positives- an interesting magic system, well written dialog, and just generally a well written, character driven story. I'm not going to expand much past that. It isn't a talent of mine to describe why or what I enjoyed about a story. Quite simply: I just did!

    And you know how you say people overplay the positives? Your buddy in that review has done worse with the negatives. I enjoyed the short paragraph that Rothfuss did for his trip to his patron. I thought it was a great tongue in cheek, tweak the readers nose and save some space type of deal. He's also done the same with how all the characters love Kvothe. And he realizes that Kvothe is telling the story, right? And that Kvothe is probably playing up the positives and down playing his negatives? Again, it was this type of wondering that made me actually enjoy Kvothe a bit more as a character. I don't really need to say much more on that review. The negativity and hyperbole contained within it are way too much for me to take seriously. He doesn't seem to appreciate character driven stories. I have a feeling he'd fail to enjoy Guy Gavriel Kay as well.

    But no, I wouldn't recommend you do read Rothfuss. I don't think you would enjoy him. But that doesn't make him "utter tripe". There are enough positive reviews available to indicate that that isn't the case.
    Well said.

    I have posted prior a huge list of incredibly positive reviews from the most relevant sources out there. I don't care much what the weekend warrior blogger has to say as they do little to influence book sales outside of their small following.

    I could approach this discussion again on literary grounds but I imagine I would simply end up getting banned. That too aggressive non sympathetic thing.

    I got nothing more too add. WMF sold like crazy. The Doors of Stone will sell like crazy. And for every one poor review I can produce fifty that are glowing. Nuff said.

    Have at it kiddos.

  15. #30
    Registered User Loerwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    But how does Kvothe have anything to do with Richard Rhal? I don't see a similarity (even in talent) at all.
    Richard is good at everything he does (Even women), and I've yet to see anything that suggests Kvothe isn't good at everything he does (Even women). You could attribute one to bad writing and one to a self-important PoV character, sure, but it's still not a great thing to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    I have a feeling he'd fail to enjoy Guy Gavriel Kay as well.
    Funnily enough, you're right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darksbane View Post
    But no, I wouldn't recommend you do read Rothfuss. I don't think you would enjoy him. But that doesn't make him "utter tripe". There are enough positive reviews available to indicate that that isn't the case.
    There's plenty of things I've watched (As an example) with glowing reviews that are tripe. If you look at the current broadcasting schedule in the UK, you'll see what I mean. Lots of people enjoy that stuff, lots of people rate it, but it doesn't mean it's great. Snog, Marry, Avoid? That's good? Apparently so.

    But thank you, it's probably for the best that I don't read the Kingthingy Thingy.

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