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  1. #1

    the expanse SPOILERS: dont like where the series is headed

    anyone here read the james sa corey expanse series?

    i dont like where the series is heading. i read the first two books and the protomolecule story that is being told is although interesting, doesnt match the story of the war between mars, OPA and earth. i was hoping that after the first book, the protomolecule arc could be side tracked while more focus is put onto the mars earth conflict.

    the first book with miller and holden was amazing i really loved it. the noire detective story and the OPA destablization with earth and mars pulling strings was great. more importantly, both miller and holden were great characters. the characters in the second book really suck. for one avasarala the UN lady is EXTREMELY boring. im reading her chapters and saying please be a holden chapter next. bobbie was a great character that got ruined with the stint of her working in some office for avasarala. the only thing bobbie found was that soren was a spy for and 5 minutes of action smacking people around in her suit. the only saving grace of the second book was holden and prax. and prax simply because his story seemed much more important and half the time he was with holden. they should have had a ngyuyen or another UN/martial admiral as a POV to flesh out the specifics of what was happening during the fighting.

    i feel like the book is moving away from the political conflicts of OPA, mars and earth. the second book was called calibans war and really there was no actual war. where was the war? the final battle was extremely anti-climatic. and the war started in the beginning seemed lackluster and there were no real perspectives on what was happening. the rocinante vs that ship at the end of leviathan wakes was way more exciting than the huge battle that felt like 3 minutes at the end of caliban's war.

    there needs to be multiple stories going on. the first book had the OPA uprising on ceres, the detective story of miller, the earth mars escalation with holden and eros storyline was very well written.

    now it seems that the earth mars storyline took a hit at the end and the only other non-protomolecule arc thats left is the fact that the OPAs influence has risen by intercepting the protomolecule that was headed for mars.

    i thoroughly hope but probably be in vain that the protomolecule story be benched for a while and have the next book focus on a great war between the OPA, mars and earth. the end of the first book provided a perfect opportunity for that with the protomolecule doing whatever its doing on venus. now ofc its too late with that massive protomolecule space monster thingy that popped out of venus at the end of calibans war but one can hope.
    Last edited by warrior6; September 10th, 2012 at 03:33 PM.

  2. #2
    \m/ BEER \m/ Moderator Rob B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by warrior6 View Post
    anyone here read the james sa corey expanse series?
    A few of us have read it:

    Leviathan Wakes by Ty Franck with Daniel Abraham, written as James Corey

    I started Caliban's War yesterday and I'm enjoying it.

  3. #3
    I loved Leviathan Wakes, it was a great, compelling story. Really liked the OPA and planet cultural differences. The characters were compelling. And the weaving back and forth between the storylines was really well done.

    I managed maybe 10 pages into Caliban's War before tossing it across the room. I thought the child-jep was a hackneyed heart-string tug at best.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Overgeeked View Post
    I loved Leviathan Wakes, it was a great, compelling story. Really liked the OPA and planet cultural differences. The characters were compelling. And the weaving back and forth between the storylines was really well done.

    I managed maybe 10 pages into Caliban's War before tossing it across the room. I thought the child-jep was a hackneyed heart-string tug at best.
    its by no means a bad book or one that isn't worth reading, its just not on the level as leviathan wakes and its in my opinion headed in the wrong direction. the speed at which things move along just way too fast.

  5. #5
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    warrior6: You and I read very different books. The whole point of Caliban's War was that Earth and Mars were trying to use the protomolecule to destroy one another so they could fight the eventual threat without having to watch their back. And the Avarasala parts were my favorite part of the book.

    Overgeeked: That is extraordinarily harsh. The child kidnapping is very important to the plot of the book, and in general someone kidnapping a child is a good action starter for a book and leads to good character moments from the parents. I think you may want to give the book a fair shot before ditching it because of a prologue that did something you didn't like, especially after enjoying the first one.

    That said, the one thing I would have changed in the book is to make Chapter 1 with Bobby the prologue, ditch the current prologue, and proceed with the other 3 PoV characters. We learned everything we were given in the prologue later, while the first chapter was really the only place it was necessary for Bobby to have her own PoV.

  6. #6
    i felt stuck in the office with avasarala and i found the character highly unlikeable. and to make it worse, the writers dragged bobbie down with avasarala by sticking her in the same place. they could have kept the loyal martial forced to work for earth theme by sticking her to a naval intelligence gig.

    there also seems to be no effort at all at trying to explain the opposition's view on the matter of protomolecule in depth. ngyuyen was reduced to just another extremely mad scientist just like the doctor who kidnapped mei. none of the villains have any substance whatsoever and this is very disappointing considering the first protogen villain in leviathan wakes who only talked for like 5 minutes before being shot was extremely interesting. the writers seem hesitant for no reason in regards to fleshing out the characters on the other side. they should have made mao kwikowski one of the of the character POVs. the end battle was also lacklustre and what they should have done was give ngyuyen very few ships and the earth/ martian forces a massive advantage. then before the ships get there, they should have tried to act like they were the real UN authority (which is what they tried to do anyway) while ngyuyen/mao kwikowski sends a great speech to all the UN ships that their only hope of beating the protomolecule was being destroyed and that it was the duty of all humanity to protect the only weapon which they could defend themselves with (or a speech along those lines), this causes mutiny in many of the UN ships who are convinced by ngyuyen and thats how a big battle should have started. they also seemed to have down played fred, another good character from leviathan wakes. fred has the potential to be a much more interesting villain or at least a much more interesting POV than the likes of avasarala or prax.


    instead what we got was rofl-stomping of the ngyuyen's forces, a rofl-stomping of the protomolecule monsters by a single marine and wam bam thank you ma'am child rescue and a rofl-stomping of the protomolecule which was launched at mars. all in what felt like 5 minutes.



    this is besides the protomolecule arc in general that i have a problem with. i was hoping that the protomolecule arc would be something like the white walkers in a song of ice and fire. that is, they are the large threat on the seemingly far horizon and there are characters dedicated to stopping it, but the there is also a big geopolitical game of back biting and chaos. the first book seemed to outline all the set pieces for such a geopolitical game which was rapidly escalating. the protomolecule arc seemed to have been given the proper temporary closure it needed so that the geopolitical arc could be properly developed by the end of the first book. its too late now with the giant space monster that appeared out of venus at the end.
    Last edited by warrior6; September 11th, 2012 at 02:33 PM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by warrior6 View Post
    i felt stuck in the office with avasarala and i found the character highly unlikeable. and to make it worse, the writers dragged bobbie down with avasarala by sticking her in the same place. they could have kept the loyal martial forced to work for earth theme by sticking her to a naval intelligence gig.
    Sorry. Avasarala is one of my favorite characters in the series. I hope she gets her own short at some point or makes a comeback, though it seems like pov characters outside Holden and his crew are mainly "guests" who you don't tend to see again.

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