Unreadable SF.

[Michigan]

Wow, I give an opinion and suddenly I'm a troll. Most people wouldn't have a problem saying they found the majority of romance novels to be shallow and unreadable...yet when I say I've read way to many bad sci-fi books I get completely flamed.

I never said all sci-fi in general was bad, I've read several sci-fis that were incredibly well written (granted I read more fantasy than sci-fi), on the other hand, I've read far more that should never have made it to print. My point was that sci-fi is a genre that often has so many people that try to write it and can't write it well that the authors and books that are actually good are hard to find.

So...geez...calm down.

Most of those people probably wouldn't waste their time on a forum for romance novels either.

[Ropie]

Wow, I give an opinion and suddenly I'm a troll.

Your opinion was bolstered with your cold, hard 'fact' that:

SF isn't usually an area that draws in the best of the best in terms of writing quality so you end up with a few gems hidden in a big steaming pile of s***...excuse the expression.

That's what annoyed me.

I never said all sci-fi in general was bad

No, just the big steaming pile that is most of it:

...a few gems hidden in a big steaming pile of s***...

Granted, SF does suffer from the occasional badly written text, some of which even manage to become widely known through the strength of their ideas or impact on a sub-genre. That is the nature of, what is, often a more experimental genre.

So...geez...calm down.

Bye bye

[LaBelle]

I have stepped out of the fantasy/sci-fi book realm and read works in all different genres, from classics to romance to semi-autobiographical and (aside from romance) no other genre has come close to the sheer number of poorly written stories that I have encountered in sci-fi.
From lizard people to a male space 'geisha' or the endless Star Trek and Star Wars spinoffs, I stand by what I said...there is no other word to call these 'books'...they are s***, and there is a LOT of them. I had to read a ton of bad sci-fi before finding The Hitchikers Guide or Brave New World and numerous others that were almost lost in 'the pile'.

[Ropie]

Usually near-future/contemporary books are of very little interest to me for various reasons

I just recalled another one I had quite a hard time with: Stand on Zanzibar. This is a great example of a book that is all about its style - part documentary, part magazine, part thriller, part stream-of-consciousness style, also set in what was the near-future (1990s, having been written in the 1960s). Absolutely ground breaking and extremely interesting but fairly close to being un-readable in parts, it is still definitely one worth sticking with to get the whole experience. The biggest problem for me was the copious use of made up futuristic slang that kept bringing the whole experience whack back to the 1960s.

[RimWorlder]

LaBelle,

sweeping generallizations will get you generally swept.

I suggest that you go find some of the various lists devoted to 'top 50 sf novels of all time' or some such and get yourself a solid grounding in classic science fiction before condemning the entire genre.

I'll agree with you on many of the sub-genres devoted to tv and movie shows - despite the occassional presence of some well known authors I personally consider those to be little more than 'fanfic'.

And I'll agree that there are an awful lot of bad, self-published sf novels out there (seems that science fiction fandom's familiarity with printing, writing and publishing makes its fans more willing than others to go the self-publishing route), but

You can't condemn an entire genre out of hand without being intimately familiar with it - both the old and the new.

[suciul]

I just recalled another one I had quite a hard time with: Stand on Zanzibar. This is a great example of a book that is all about its style - part documentary, part magazine, part thriller, part stream-of-consciousness style, also set in what was the near-future (1990s, having been written in the 1960s). Absolutely ground breaking and extremely interesting but fairly close to being un-readable in parts, it is still definitely one worth sticking with to get the whole experience. The biggest problem for me was the copious use of made up futuristic slang that kept bringing the whole experience whack back to the 1960s.

I've read Stand on Zanzibar about 15 years ago or so, so it was more of alt-history for me then; I agree that it's a weird book, but I do not mind dense or weird stuff from time to time - for me unreadable is mostly boring, something that utterly does not interest me, or something that fails the "suspension of disbelief" test; and most near future sf and thrillers or supernatural fantasy fail on that last count for me - no particular judgement on the "quality" of the writing itself; after all time is limited so you gotta prioritize.

[LaBelle]

sweeping generallizations will get you generally swept.

I suggest that you go find some of the various lists devoted to 'top 50 sf novels of all time' or some such and get yourself a solid grounding in classic science fiction before condemning the entire genre.

I didn't condemn the whole genre...I'm a huge fan of sci-fi (more tv shows than books) and have read enough sci-fi, both good and bad, new and old, to form an opinion. I didn't just start reading sci-fi yesterday, come on a forum and decide to say the whole genre sucked as many people seemed to take it.
I pointed out the fact that for every good author in the genre there seems to be 10 bad ones, the bad far outweigh the good in sheer numbers and so most are unreadable.

[Erfael]

I didn't condemn the whole genre...I'm a huge fan of sci-fi (more tv shows than books) and have read enough sci-fi, both good and bad, new and old, to form an opinion. I didn't just start reading sci-fi yesterday, come on a forum and decide to say the whole genre sucked as many people seemed to take it.
I pointed out the fact that for every good author in the genre there seems to be 10 bad ones, the bad far outweigh the good in sheer numbers and so most are unreadable.

I wonder, have you heard of Sturgeon's Law?

[Chuffalump]

I never said all sci-fi in general was bad, I've read several sci-fis that were incredibly well written (granted I read more fantasy than sci-fi), on the other hand, I've read far more that should never have made it to print. My point was that sci-fi is a genre that often has so many people that try to write it and can't write it well that the authors and books that are actually good are hard to find.

Ha ha. If you think that, try reading Westerns. I went through a phase of reading them when I was a nipper...... boy are there some 10 year old English students published in that game.

As far as bad SF is concerned... did Keith Laumer write the Bolo books? I loved all of them but I've just finished A Plague of Demons and it was as if it was written by a different person (I always finish the book... eternal optimist that I am).

[acereader]

There is certainly no denying that within the SF genre there is a lot of dreck. However, it is easy to find tons of good stuff as well.

I find relatively little SF unreadable. Just look at my sign on, acereader. It doesn't stand for my reading ability, but the Ace Doubles that I collect and love. It is certainly a collection full of the worst and best of SF. I also collect Tom Swift, Tom Swift Jr., Dig Allen, Winston Juvenile SF Series, Rick Brant, Roy Rockwood Titles, and tons of other older pulp SF. They are just escapist fun. I like the scary tentacled monsters, or robots gone mad. Adventure fiction set in a SF world is just out and out fun.

But, I also enjoy deep character driven works and they are so easy to find. Not everyone is a go to the used bookstore and pick a book by the cover reader. Some have more refined tastes I suppose.

SF is not alone in the dreck though. Pulps on crime, Westens, Romance, and every fiction genre known to man has more than its fair share of steamy, smelly piles of excrement. I see no more in SF than in any other - well that is if you eliminate the TV/Movie tie-ins. Then again it was not that long ago there were TV tie-in Lassie books.

[LaBelle]

I wonder, have you heard of Sturgeon's Law?

It's true...but I'm not using the worst of the bunch to say all sci-fi is crap...just a great deal of it written by people who think they are the next George Lucas that brings down the whole genre and gives it a bad rep.

Ha ha. If you think that, try reading Westerns. I went through a phase of reading them when I was a nipper...... boy are there some 10 year old English students published in that game.

No thanks, I went through a harlequin romance phase waaaay back in the day, I lost a few brain cells but thankfully came out with my soul more or less intact. x.x

[Muskdog]

I tend to read plenty of reviews before diving into a book, as I have precious little time to read I can't waste it on getting 100 pages into a stinker only to realise I am not really enjoying it at all and simply can't go any further.

[Ariana]

I am currently reading 'Elom' (*book in other room, author not impressed me enough to remember name). Well let's just say that is is a little bit repeatative, like that poltergiest movie and the constant "Carol Anne". In this case it is Shetow-ka, or just Shetow. *sigh... I finally am into chapter 3. For me that indicates a bad book, because I can knock out a 500 page story in one day or less, depending on how much I want to savor the experience. Sometimes I will force myself to put a great book down to prolong the pleasure. Conversly, if it is a struggle to complete a paragragh, chances are I will let it sit for weeks, or stick it in the restroom to read.

So at this point it is the book I would list as a loser. I hold out hope because I sprung $25.00 based on the back cover snippet and the artwork on the cover. So since I can't find my darn reciept, I can't take it back to B&N!

I have read that others also do not care for this author's book. He is new, and maybe took on too much to accomplish. Either way it is best left to wait for the bargain bin IMVHO

Ariana