Witchcraft And Demons

[BrianP]

Let me make this perfectly clear before I post, I'm not one of those religious people who try ramming stuff down your throat but my friend let me borrow this book that was really good! It was supposed to actually happened in Dallas Texas. To me, it was a horror book about demonic attacks and witchcraft and other supernatural occurrences that happened to these people. What caught my attention is the people these things were actually happening too began receiving help by some divine force during the whole ordeal. The book's called JOHN 1:12, yea I know... real churchy title but a good read?

[TerryV]

Yea, I read it too. I kinda believed it, especially the part about the demonic possession attempt in the mall. Who can make up stuff like that? We're living in f___ up times. It might can happen.

[silverfang]

Maybe I'm stapping away from the orginal intent of this topic but reading these posts these thoughts come to me that,this is the year of 2005 and one still speaks the words of Witchcraft And Demons in one breath.
I think that to be a shame,for it are both are entire not related to eachother.
Last week there was a program on discovery channel,named the history of hell.
After vewing this program I find that the church in the name of Christianity still like to preach that Witchcraft stands equal to demons and satisme.

[MURRY1pl]

In the book, the people doing witchcraft were hurting people and
the demons were hurting people. The common factor between
the two was hurt and pain. The two equal one another. I don't see
any difference.

[silverfang]

I,myself drift around from Christianity to other religions.Speaking with both camps,not feeling home by both.
Anyway one thing I do understand that Christians see Pagans as evil,connected to the devil.
Most are rooted in old wife tales and ignorance.
Pagans preach love and understanding for life and nature,there is a common interest.Witches have a oath to uphold,the 3 fold law..basecly this tells a person who performs the art of witchcraft not to hurt any living creature,be in man or beast.Some I guess do stray from that path,but they get banned as result.Most witches do not like to be associated with them.Or do like to be associate with so called satanism.
I think that there lays the core of misunderstanding.

[northerain]

A nice book on witchcraft and demons is ''The History of Demonology and Witchcraft''*(well duh!) by Montague Summers(somewhat famous researcher). ''Heavy'' reading so to speak, but very enlightening.

[Michael2000]

Originally Posted by silverfang

I,myself drift around from Christianity to other religions.Speaking with both camps,not feeling home by both.
Anyway one thing I do understand that Christians see Pagans as evil,connected to the devil.
Most are rooted in old wife tales and ignorance.
Pagans preach love and understanding for life and nature,there is a common interest.Witches have a oath to uphold,the 3 fold law..basecly this tells a person who performs the art of witchcraft not to hurt any living creature,be in man or beast.Some I guess do stray from that path,but they get banned as result.Most witches do not like to be associated with them.Or do like to be associate with so called satanism.
I think that there lays the core of misunderstanding.

First I think I'll address the point about the 3-fold law. The 3-fold law is Wiccan, which is an eclectic belief. I understand that Traditional Witches are not bound by any such law. As far breaking the law, I guess it's possible that someone who does may be branded an Oath-breaker, but the root of this law is in Eastern philosophy and it has something to do with karma. If a person breaks the law, Wiccans believe that whatever wrong was done will eventually catch up with the wrongdoer--if you get my meaning.

I think you're right that that Witches do not like to associate with Oath-breakers and that they do not like their religion(s) compared to Satanism.

On the other hand, many Christians see pagans as evil because "the Bible says so," not so much that pagan belief is based on "old wive's tales and ignorance."

Since a lot of pagan mythology is older than Christian texts, much of it does seem confusing. But, in context, it may not be quite so confusing. Darn, I'm so lazy, I'll look this up later: There is an old poem about the Milesian invasion of Ireland and how the gods became "part of the land." In it, the protagonist says that he is a different kind of animal one moment and another in the next. In shamanic belief, a person can "shape-shift" in a way that is akin to "astral projection." Astral projections don't seem much different from other religious experiences to me, as they are described in different texts, such as "visions" or "revelations." If one of these is based on "old wive's tales and ignorance" then they all are.

Besides, I really don't see what's so ignorant about calling the Sun a "god"--or some other pagan association. In reality, the Sun sure is lot more powerful than me whether I personify it or not. Since I believe that deity is both imminent and transcendent, "God" is in the Sun as much as He is in anything else, including people.

EDIT: Sorry, it seems like that last paragragh was a bit heavy-handed. I actually made a statement of belief, which maybe is not appropriate for this thread. I just meant to state the representation of deity in pan- or panentheistic philosophy.

And just in case, I understand that Traditional Witchcraft is not pantheistic but polytheistic, but polytheism still associates gods with forces of nature in one way or another.

[FistfulOfSky]

Originally Posted by silverfang

I,myself drift around from Christianity to other religions.Speaking with both camps,not feeling home by both.
Anyway one thing I do understand that Christians see Pagans as evil,connected to the devil.
Most are rooted in old wife tales and ignorance.
Pagans preach love and understanding for life and nature,there is a common interest.Witches have a oath to uphold,the 3 fold law..basecly this tells a person who performs the art of witchcraft not to hurt any living creature,be in man or beast.Some I guess do stray from that path,but they get banned as result.Most witches do not like to be associated with them.Or do like to be associate with so called satanism.
I think that there lays the core of misunderstanding.

i agree with you! i think people assume way too quickly. i call myself Wiccan. true i'm no expert and now and then i have my doubts on some issues. but i do know what it is not. and it is in no way shape or form related that has anything to do with the Christian faith. meaning it is not related to Satanism. like you said. i also believe this religion is really misunderstood. when people ask me my religion and i respond sometimes they get scared or offended. it makes me sad that this beautiful and unique religion got such a bad reputation.

i will check out this book however. it does sound interesting. of course i'm into things like that.