Reading in Science Fiction, August 2020

[Av Demeisen]

Damn! I wish I had $200 to throw at this:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1291479418385334274

 

[AtramentousFlux]

Think it was at just over 100 pages I stalled at...

As did I, but later went back to it and found it rapidly became more engaging from there. Or maybe it was just my mood at the time. I liked it.

 

[Spacer Mark]

I recently finished The Shape of Things to Come by good ol H.G. Wells and Foundation by Isaac Asimov.

I have really complicated feelings about the former; I feel like I would've been ecstatic about Wells' politics in mid high school, but the years I've spent trying to challenge those principles has left me very suspicious of that particular brand of utopianism. I decided to read this because I love the movie and find it really important, both through the elements I find appealing about it and the elements I question and am dissatisfied with. In a sense it's a matrix which I find helpful to analyze a lot of other sci-fi works and political issues. The book reads like a historical analysis, which makes it really dry. Wells' vision for the future is very grounded with pivotal forces and developments in the world being economic, with only a few exceptional individuals involved to pull the world forward.

The part of me that enjoys philosophy and theory kept me going through it, but ideologically it has a lot of troubling implications. While Wells is very openly anti-fascism, I think they accidentally reproduce a lot of fascistic qualities within their vision of a future utopia. Granted, there is a difference between saying that the world is the way it is because of the necessary role authoritarianism played in its development and actually saying that that authoritarianism was justified. That's the mode in which one still has to read the book narratively, because neither the use of Raven as a framing device nor the made-up historical footnotes and texts can change the fact that The Shape of Things to Come is fiction. That means it isn't really any different from other philosophical texts in that it makes a claim to the truth, but it is unique in that its futuristic/predictive element gives it a literary edge and a tone of self-certainty that I have yet to see anywhere else.

That's also, however, why I think the book (and consequently the film) are so important; one of the greatest sci-fi songs ever made is Bear McCreary's "The Shape of Things to Come" track for the first season of Battlestar Galactica. The self-assuredness of Wells' title and their claim to truth/universality immediately opens it up to criticism, opposition, and revision: "No, this is the shape of things to come!" While some great works please and amaze, they often become footnotes in the history of the genre, but The Shape of Things to Come I think is both a perfect example and representative of many of the themes and dialogs in sci-fi, and creates a meaningful connection between the genre and the philosophical landscape of our reality. It's not just about progress or what is going to happen, but about the frustrations, anxieties, dialectics, and paradoxes surrounding those ideas--both on textual, subtextual, and (most importantly) metatextual levels. I've come to the conclusion some time ago that science fiction is reality (or rather, the other way around, and both), and it The Shape of Things to Come reflects this perfectly through its extremely uncertain but presumptuous relationship to the Truth.


Anyway, Foundation is interesting! It's clearly just the first installment of something bigger, and I'm interested to see what that unfolds into. Curiously enough it has a lot of parallels with The Shape of Things to Come in terms of its themes, questions, and conceptions of humanity. It's well structured and I only started to lose interest toward the end. It's not what I expected, or even what I hoped, but it seems important to stick with it. It's also a less narratively satisfying experience but it has a lot going on. Funnily enough, this is actually my first foray into Asimov's novels. I've read all of the short stories in Robot Dreams and love many of them, so I'm familiar with Asimov's voice and ideas, but it's interesting to see what becomes a novel and what stays a short story because there were clearly some that I would not have minded to see expanded (particularly "Hostess" comes to mind).

Apologies again for the long post and any goofy grammar...!

 

[Hobbit]

Apologies again for the long post and any goofy grammar...!

Never apologise, Mark - we like long posts at SFFWorld!

Your points on Things to Come are well made. In the 1920s & 30s some of the Utopian ideas, which HG seems to have believed in, in part, bordered on the edge of eugenics. Not the only one to think like that, sadly, but I don't think he had thought it through as far as that. Many of the ideas were still locked into social class, and the idea of an elite still appealed to those with money, power & influence, I think.

Science Fiction often mirrors the culture it is written in at the time - perhaps more so than that old cliche of predicting the future!

Yes: Foundation. There's a new TV series on the way, did you know?

 

[Spacer Mark]

Science Fiction often mirrors the culture it is written in at the time - perhaps more so than that old cliche of predicting the future!

Yes: Foundation. There's a new TV series on the way, did you know?

Yeah, absolutely. I don't particularly begrudge Wells so much as I find them fascinating for the very fact you bring up. Their extreme oppositional socialist ideals somehow coexist with a lot of their sympomatic residual ones, making the work--and the writer--complex and worth interrogation. It's a little hard to confront some parts of Wells' argument because they are truly a brilliant writer with an imaginitive scope that's hard to match, but once one gets past all the layers of rhetoric and prose it's clear to see how a lot of their ideas are as much culmination of as reactions to the effects of the industrial revolution and the first World War. Still, some of Wells' observations about mass society and politics remain eerily relevant...

I have seen the trailer for the new series, yes! It looks quite exciting. I'm curious to see how it's going to be adapted considering the novel adapts a repetitive structure to showcase each of the Hardin incidents; each incident is solved by some exceptional individual being clever enough to subvert the status quo and maneuver the Foundation into a necessary direction. For the novel I think the repetitive structure works great considering each time focuses on the development of a different mode of Foundation society (science/independence, religion, trade), but for a tv show it might be a challenge to dramatize effectively. Not to mention that each of the masterminds behind the solutions to the Hardin incidents felt similar in personality. Still, with good direction and writing there's every reason to be optimistic (Though I still actually have yet to watch For All Mankind, which looks awesome and is made by Ronald D. Moore!).

 

[Hobbit]

I'm curious to see how it's going to be adapted

We've talked a bit about this in the TV Forums. I suspect that they've gone for the big picture - one that will involve robots/robotics as well as the original Trilogy. This gives them enough material for a series of possibly more than one season.

Though I still actually have yet to watch For All Mankind, which looks awesome and is made by Ronald D. Moore

Also talked about in the TV thread. I liked it, though it sags a little in the middle. They are nearly at the end of making Season 2 as well - COVID stopped final production.

 

[Windshadow]

Which film version of The Shape of Things to Come are you liking? I notice both are included with my Amazon Prime service, so I should rewatch them both... the 1936 version with Ramond Massy Is the one I liked when it would turn up on after midnight local TV
Things To Come
or the 1979 version with Jack Palance with its more modern production values? I can't recall anything about this version
The Shape of Things to Come

 

[Spacer Mark]

Which film version of The Shape of Things to Come are you liking? I notice both are included with my Amazon Prime service, so I should rewatch them both... the 1936 version with Ramond Massy Is the one I liked when it would turn up on after midnight local TV
Things To Come
or the 1979 version with Jack Palance with its more modern production values? I can't recall anything about this version
The Shape of Things to Come

I'm a huge fan of the 1936 version! I've seen it I think three times now, twice in black and white and once in color.

I haven't seen the the 1979 version but I definitely plan to once I finish Babylon 5; I've had it on my list just waiting for me to finish the book!

 

[Matt H.]

Finished The Long Tomorrow two days ago. I will be writing a "full review" along with my others. Started Lest Darkness Fall... light, fun reading so far! @krisbslick, would love to hear what you thought of Childhood's End when you finish. A major, important work unquestionably... Will be interested in what you thought of it *as a book*

 

[Westy]

I started on Afterland by Lauren Beukes , got nearly 30% in and have gone on to something else. It's another post pandemic story, this time one that targets mainly men so only women are left. It was OK, but a bit too familiar and the characters weren't that interesting, plus it was a bit too much about them at the expense of advancing the story...

 

[suciul]

Finished a book (and a reread of the previous series book) and put aside another:

Stormblood by J Szal: a lot of promise, but soon it became a book I've read with better prose, story, and more compelling characters a few times before, so it went on the discarded pile; may try it again when book 2 appears as who knows, it may not have been the right moment for me to try this one

Fleet Elements (Praxis 5 1/2) (and Accidental War - Praxis 4 1/2 reread) by WJ Williams -
It's a middle book with some of the middle book's faults (setting up a finale, advancing the story just enough), while there is an element of artificiality in the main characters interactions as opposed to the first books of the series, but Fleet Elements delivers a lot too - a faster pace than Accidental War, decisive military encounters, a great ending in many ways (not to the main storyline of course but still - won't spoil more) and more, so overall it was another book not to put down until the ending and as noted in my current review of Accidental war, the novel rekindled my interest in the series, so the final book (presumably of course as the storyline started in Accidental war doesn't look like having more than one book to go) is an asap again

Overall - definitely recommended

 

[krisbslick]

@krisbslick, would love to hear what you thought of Childhood's End when you finish. A major, important work unquestionably... Will be interested in what you thought of it *as a book*

When you say "as a book", I'm assuming you mean my take on reading the novel vs a movie/tv show based on the book. (Is there even a version in another form of media? Sorry, I'm clueless on some of what's out there.)

Anyways, I thought the first third was really pretty good, which was when I made my first comment on this thread. Kind of reminded me of 1950s version of Arrival (hell of a movie!) So, far so good.

But, then things started to get a little wierd for me...

Spoiler

The 'big reveal' turned me off honestly - it felt like a cop out. The overlords had so much potential and could have been so unique, but instead we got some uninspired supernatural being.

Fortunately, the story got me hooked again with the introduction to Jan and his storyline. But again, that turned out to be a bust too. Jan could have somehow released earth from the overlords' rule, but he turned out to only be a plot device to document "the end".

That brings up the last third of the story -Really... some pagen ritual by a handful of child mutants gets the world sucked into another dimension. Come on...

Otherwise, the rest of the cast were typical Clarke - bland and uninteresting, which is just fine by me. Good world building and a decent storyline are usually all I need - I enjoyed Rendezvous with Rama.

From the couple of Clarke novels I've read, this felt more like Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land than Clarke. For me, at least, Childhood's End "jumped the shark" a bit in the end.

 

[cgw]

And.... how's it going? (Think it was at just over 100 pages I stalled at...)

I'm half way through (which means I'll finish it). The only thing that bugs me is that the protagonist seems to be bungling her way through her job as an ambassador, even though it is something she supposedly trained for (even considering what happened early in the book). Alternating between taking offence at things and being clueless.

 

[Windshadow]

I liked the 1953 version of his early novel Against the Fall of Night, rather more than his cleanup of it and republication of it in 1956 as The City and the Stars but without rereading them I could not tell you why from memory. I do recall That I liked them both more than Childhood's End.
Hobbit promised a compare and contrast of the two versions a few years ago but if he ever got around to it I don't recall seeing the post.

From Wikipedia.

Clarke began carving out his reputation as a "scientific" science-fiction writer with his first science-fiction novel, Against the Fall of Night, published as a novella in 1948. It was very popular and considered ground-breaking work for some of the concepts it contained. Clarke revised and expanded the novella into a full novel, which was published in 1953. Clarke later rewrote and expanded this work a third time to become The City and the Stars in 1956, which rapidly became a definitive must-read in the field. His third science-fiction novel, Childhood's End, was also published in 1953, cementing his popularity. Clarke capped the first phase of his writing career with his sixth novel, A Fall of Moondust, in 1961, which is also an acknowledged classic of the period

 

[Matt H.]

When you say "as a book", I'm assuming you mean my take on reading the novel vs a movie/tv show based on the book.

Hey Kris, thanks. Yeah guess that was vague... meant I guess as a story and *reading experience* (does it feel like an artistic whole?) Seems like I had some of the same reactions you did. This is my review. Though maybe I liked it more as a conception... I found the writing actually a little rough sometimes and the story choppy in places. It's got a pretty daring ending, I think you'll admit (?)

 

[Hobbit]

Hobbit promised a compare and contrast of the two versions a few years ago but if he ever got around to it I don't recall seeing the post.

Good point. I think I did it, but I can't remember what I did with it! Apologies.

 

[Sea Serpent]

Interesting to see I’m not the only person struggling with Children of Ruin. I keep putting it aside, reading something else and then giving it another go. Yet I absolutely loved Children of Time!

Anyway, I’ve just set it aside again and I’ve picked up Cage of Souls which I’m finding really gripping!

 

[Windshadow]

I am reading all the murderbot stories by Martha Wells one after the other as if they were one larger book, rereading in the case of the first 2 I think I like them better this way than consumed at intervals of several months

 

[krisbslick]

Hey Kris, thanks. Yeah guess that was vague... meant I guess as a story and *reading experience* (does it feel like an artistic whole?) Seems like I had some of the same reactions you did. This is my review. Though maybe I liked it more as a conception... I found the writing actually a little rough sometimes and the story choppy in places. It's got a pretty daring ending, I think you'll admit (?)

I'd agree with the daring ending statement, it just seemed a little... I dont know, too fantastical, I guess, and escalated too quickly. Your review seems to parallel my thoughts though - with you being not as harsh as me.

 

[Westy]

Anyway, I’ve just set it aside again and I’ve picked up Cage of Souls which I’m finding really gripping!

I found that too, but things seem to wane after initial good part...hopefully you get more out of it.