Things you hate to see in an sffworld thread

[Rob B]

And my second question is why are books reviewed here if no one is allowed to talk about the reviews unless it is a well known popular author. Other than that I love this site and visit it daily but that is my thing I hate to see in a post.

Hobbit and I were posting new threads whenever we posted new book reviews, but that practice just sort of fell by the wayside. However, If you (in the general sense) want to discuss one of the books we reviewed, well then by all means.

 

[fk1523]

JohnH, a bit over the top and melodramatic. I'll assume you were you joking.

 

[chitman13]

I've been a member on here for nearly two years but don't tend to contribute as much as I think I should, mainly because I don't want my posts to be classed as spamming. I come from a history of moderating a very popular forum for a game guide company (which unfortunately closed down a couple of years back) and there were some rather strict rules in place about what was and wasn't permitted. That has sort of stuck with me and I always tend to think whether the couple of lines I'd be posting are needed or would be either going off topic or spam.

I think I'm starting to come around from this now and I'm finding SFF World a very nice place to visit and discuss stuff. I think the main problem though is that some people just don't have an interest in some topics and therefore don't contribute - but that has and always will happen.

With regards to posting full reviews in posts rather than re-writing your thoughts, I'm coming around in my view. When I first started posting in the 'Reading in..' threads I was giving a couple of lines about my thoughts, but it slowly turned into me just re-posting my full reviews to save time and get all my thoughts across - after all, I put time and effort into them. I'm now growing out of that and trying to re-write my thoughts to put them across better.

It's all well and good re-posting a full review, but posting a review on a blog and posting one on a forum are two completely different environments. A forum is a discussion area and as such any reviews, thoughts and ramblings about a book should be written in such a way to encourage discussion. I'll still post some full reviews, but only if I think it is suited to where I'm posting them.

I also like the fact that SFF World split Fantasy, Sci-Fi and Horror into seperate categories, simply because I don't read fantasy and don't want to have to go through a load of posts in one general forum that don't apply to me.

As long as there is a discussion board here I'll be visiting - it's a great place.

EDIT - Rob, although I'm glad new topics are no longer started for single reviews (I really hate that), it'd be nice to see you guys post a little summary in the 'Reading in..' threads, it might encourage some more discussion.

 

[Rob B]

EDIT - Rob, although I'm glad new topics are no longer started for single reviews (I really hate that), it'd be nice to see you guys post a little summary in the 'Reading in..' threads, it might encourage some more discussion.

Fair enough, I suppose that is one way we can approach posting our SFFWorld reviews.

In terms of consolidating things, perhaps a meld of Fantasy and horror into one forum? Thoughts?

fk1523, I thought JohnH made some good points

 

[Amaunette]

Nice thread, over all. I just wanted to mention that I do appreciate when bloggers and others post reviews of books, even if they're not out yet, and even if they're single-post threads with no replies. Besides the "Reading In..." thread, this is my main way of finding out what else I might read next. It does make it harder if the book is not out yet, but it's not actually a big problem. Please don't make all the reviews go into one thread, that would be annoying.

 

[Stenny]

i like fantasy, sci-fi and horror being separate, it saves going through loads of threads to find the ones that relates to fantasy.

I love this site, and I don't really think there's much on here that I don't like (except the occassional 'can't get on the site' issue).

The only thing I don't like, is people who think they know everything and won't except anyone else's opinion. We are all entitled to our thoughts, who are we to say who's wrong and who's right. Just so long as it doesn't get too personal.

 

[JohnH]

I think you need to get out a little more, if you actually pay this much attention.

You are an idiot. I am an idiot. Everyone is an idiot. This is the internet, people are going to do the above for as long as it exists.

Or I could just stay in, or get out, at exactly the same extent which currently serves me very well. Even if it is not to the degree you apparently think I should. And continue to feel free to air my opinions and thoughts when asked such as this thread did, in the exact manner I already did. And if that two second thought and five minute typed post style is so lacking and prompts one to point how how wrong I am for daring to do so? Well tell you what. I'll change my living will so that if I ever fall into a persistent vegetative state and Bill Frist isn't available to view the video, I name you the person who does my thinking and expressing of those thoughts for me. Phyllis is it? Until then, I think I'll go with what works for me. Whether it works for you or not. But feel free to continue to disparage people for not thinking and reacting as you feel they should. "This is the internet" after all. Plus you do a bang up job of providing examples for several of the points I find annoying. The Dogmatic Church of How Others Should Think the Way I Think They Should. What time is Sunday service by the way?

JohnH, a bit over the top and melodramatic. I'll assume you were you joking

Wait till you get a load of what I just typed! Oh the myriad of pitfalls one faces when one tries to identify what I find funny and what I don't. Let alone when I am apparently not get out enough. You and Phyllis have so very, very much to talk about. Start with me and how I don't measure up to your standards in posting my opinion on this very matter.

 

[suciul]

Nice thread, over all. I just wanted to mention that I do appreciate when bloggers and others post reviews of books, even if they're not out yet, and even if they're single-post threads with no replies. Besides the "Reading In..." thread, this is my main way of finding out what else I might read next. It does make it harder if the book is not out yet, but it's not actually a big problem. Please don't make all the reviews go into one thread, that would be annoying.

One thing I do about remembering books is add any interesting sounding book that I hear about to my Amazon (or .uk, wherever it is listed) wish list. Later at my leisure I can look when it was/will be published, do I want it and so on.

I agree that I like a lot both reviews and mentions of new books - that thread of new interesting 08 releases was great and I like having more threads than too long threads that are a pain to wade through.

 

[KatG]

Alrighty, John, go a little easy, especially on newer members, please. You made your points. And folks, let's not do the post style critique thing, thanks.

We do try to alert people to reviews, but sometimes they haven't had time to do it. However, anyone can check out a SFFWorld review on the main page -- or for that matter a review of one of the bloggers on their blogs -- and talk about it in a thread here. There are no SFFH books or short stories that you cannot talk about here.

This includes SFFH that is in general fiction (there is no lit fiction versus speculative fiction.) The category market is not a wall. We are not obligated only to talk about books from Del Rey or Orbit UK. If you want to talk about a writer like Brian Everson or Gabriel Garcia Marquez or whatever, do it. Eventine and Yobmod will be thrilled and join right in, and I will too. Books that don't have any SFFH elements in them can be discussed in the General Literature section, but anything with SFFH in it is ours and ours to discuss.

Authors don't get accused of spam for thanking us for reviewing them -- by us anyway. They are free to join in discussions about their books and other discussions as well, and to mention their fiction if it's relevant to a thread topic. Some members seem to feel the presence of an author is spamming, but we've certainly tried to disabuse that notion. What we don't allow is an author joining the forums and doing lots of threads on his own work and mentioning his work at every opportunity -- in other words, is just here to try and promote his stuff. Luckily, that's happened very infrequently.

I'm not sure how we're going to deal with the multiple threads versus long thread issue. Some long threads seem to work, such as the Supernatural Fantasy thread, which is about all contemporary fantasy at this point. But clearly some folk don't like them. So any other feedback on this issue would be helpful? How would you like the Recommendations to be? (I don't think we could have a top 100 list, because, as John said, there is no best book, and if we tried it, I think we'd probably have a riot about who was on it.)

Would people be interested in a thread on classic fantasy authors (classic in the sense that many of them are still around, breathing and publishing and having stuff in print)? I think we've had some in the past -- I'd have to root around the archives. But there does seem to be some interest in the what classics should I read question. Of course, you shouldn't have to read anything, but you might like to read certain titles that sound good to you.

 

[Andols]

My only complaints would be:

Mithfanion, Werthead and that kid who loves Jordan with all off his heart and soul.

Seeing a Mith or Werthead post usually makes me scroll like my life depends on it. You guys make a great point occasionally but I'm not reading 1700 words to find it. If you two and Fung Ku every congregate in one thread I will be in a galaxy far, far away.

The Jordan Lover I cannot abide only because I held similar opinions when I was 15 and I cannot face that part of myself ever again.

Other than that I like the majority of the peeves listed in this thread. I think if anything they get recognized for their repetition and fuel other forms of discussion and debate.

 

[Andols]

Alrighty, John, go a little easy, especially on newer members, please. You made your points. And folks, let's not do the post style critique thing, thanks.

We do try to alert people to reviews, but sometimes they haven't had time to do it. However, anyone can check out a SFFWorld review on the main page -- or for that matter a review of one of the bloggers on their blogs -- and talk about it in a thread here. There are no SFFH books or short stories that you cannot talk about here.

This includes SFFH that is in general fiction (there is no lit fiction versus speculative fiction.) The category market is not a wall. We are not obligated only to talk about books from Del Rey or Orbit UK. If you want to talk about a writer like Brian Everson or Gabriel Garcia Marquez or whatever, do it. Eventine and Yobmod will be thrilled and join right in, and I will too. Books that don't have any SFFH elements in them can be discussed in the General Literature section, but anything with SFFH in it is ours and ours to discuss.

Authors don't get accused of spam for thanking us for reviewing them -- by us anyway. They are free to join in discussions about their books and other discussions as well, and to mention their fiction if it's relevant to a thread topic. Some members seem to feel the presence of an author is spamming, but we've certainly tried to disabuse that notion. What we don't allow is an author joining the forums and doing lots of threads on his own work and mentioning his work at every opportunity -- in other words, is just here to try and promote his stuff. Luckily, that's happened very infrequently.

I'm not sure how we're going to deal with the multiple threads versus long thread issue. Some long threads seem to work, such as the Supernatural Fantasy thread, which is about all contemporary fantasy at this point. But clearly some folk don't like them. So any other feedback on this issue would be helpful? How would you like the Recommendations to be? (I don't think we could have a top 100 list, because, as John said, there is no best book, and if we tried it, I think we'd probably have a riot about who was on it.)

Would people be interested in a thread on classic fantasy authors (classic in the sense that many of them are still around, breathing and publishing and having stuff in print)? I think we've had some in the past -- I'd have to root around the archives. But there does seem to be some interest in the what classics should I read question. Of course, you shouldn't have to read anything, but you might like to read certain titles that sound good to you.

To be fair I wrote my last post before I saw this one.

I'm not critiquing Mith or Wert exactly. And I'm sure they wont hate me all that much.

 

[Amaunette]

I'm not sure how we're going to deal with the multiple threads versus long thread issue. Some long threads seem to work, such as the Supernatural Fantasy thread, which is about all contemporary fantasy at this point. But clearly some folk don't like them. So any other feedback on this issue would be helpful? How would you like the Recommendations to be? ...

Would people be interested in a thread on classic fantasy authors (classic in the sense that many of them are still around, breathing and publishing and having stuff in print)? ...

I think the long threads vs multiple threads question was raised before by people who were annoyed that a new thread was deleted because it was a repetition of an existing, longer thread. Their question was often referred to an existing thread. This is a moderator issue and none of my business besides. I think the mods will have to use their best judgment on what deserves its own thread and what ought to be routed to an existing thread, just as they always have. I prefer shorter threads because I lack patience.

There seems to be few choices as regards Recommendations:
1) Put recommendations in the main Fantasy forum (or SF or Horror forum, as applicable). This facilitiates discussion since that's where most people look for new forum posts, but perhaps that's just me. It therefore has the advantage that more people will see the request for recommendations. It may also lead to spin-off discussions that are relevant to the main forum.
2) Leave recommendations in the all-encompassing Recommendations Thread, which seems absurd at this point. It's a ridiculously long thread and it's hard to find something especially if you have no firm opinion on what you're looking for. This does work, however, for those oft-repeated recommendations, like "please recommend a book that's just like ASOIAF."
3) Create a new sub-forum for recommendations only. This means that people can create new threads as desired and creates a clearly-defined and organized location for recommendation threads to go. However, as mentioned above, some recommendation threads burst out of their initially self-interested shells and develop into interesting discussion that is relevant to the main forum. I would perhaps suggest that only threads in the vein "please recommend me something like..." or "please recommend my next book" would belong in that sub-forum.

Are there any other obvious options I missed?

Lastly, I believe a thread on classic fantasy authors would be difficult to navigate, like the Recommendations thread.

 

[fk1523]

Wait till you get a load of what I just typed! Oh the myriad of pitfalls one faces when one tries to identify what I find funny and what I don't. Let alone when I am apparently not get out enough. You and Phyllis have so very, very much to talk about. Start with me and how I don't measure up to your standards in posting my opinion on this very matter.

Sorry, I don't think I'm up to the challenge. Too much to say, too little time.

I didn't mean to offend, i just thought a couple of your statements were a bit hypocritical, especially point #2. By the way, since everyone's a hypocrite, including me, you're not alone. I just try not to be too obvious about it.

Lastly, please do not put me in the same category as anyone else. I am special, unique and incomprehensible, even to myself.

And even though I believe I was trying not to offend, I am a hypocrite and since most jokes aren't truly funny unless someone gets hurt, I guess subconciously, I was. My bad.

Would people be interested in a thread on classic fantasy authors (classic in the sense that many of them are still around, breathing and publishing and having stuff in print)? I think we've had some in the past -- I'd have to root around the archives. But there does seem to be some interest in the what classics should I read question. Of course, you shouldn't have to read anything, but you might like to read certain titles that sound good to you.

Yes, KatG, a thread on what one should and shouldn't read would be great. Elitism at its finest. I agree, one shouldn't have to read certain titles, but then, how would we know which is "better"? Its like modern art. Since most of it looks like a 5-year old made it, you really can't have a meaningful discussion about a piece of art nowadays without understanding its relative historical significance.

hmmm...I wonder if the relationship between art and writing is really that close. that would mean Goodkinds writing...

 

[Raule]

Feedback

Hmm…

I don’t mind the book reviews. If I’m not interested, I can skip them, and I think most of the reviewers here do contribute to threads and are quite approachable if we want to engage them in a discussion.

As for long threads, maybe they should have a time duration (for a popular topic, start a new one every year?) or page limit (start a new one after x number of posts). I'm not going to remember half of what's been discussed in a thread that's over 20 pages in length. This is the drawback to the What Can you Tell Me About X Author thread.

I don’t think it’s so much a case of what I hate to see… it’s more a case of what I’d like to see, which is more readers engaging one another as readers (not from an Industry/Market category PoV, but as individuals expressing their honest, gut reactions to a work).

I do hate to see readers with a genuine interest in SFF be summarily dismissed by rabid consumers and industry insiders for not being a religious and consistent subscriber of the genres, or worse, made to feel stupid.

I do think SFFWorld does a better job than other boards I’ve visited in keeping it civil and mature between members. For the most part, this is a pleasant place to learn about SFF and trade thoughts and ideas with other readers. I’m so glad SFFWorld doesn’t allow the graphics with the signatures. I hate visiting boards where someone posts one line, but the poster’s signature line takes up half the page.

Does anyone wonder if all boards are going through an awkward transitional phase? It seems posters all over the net, whether it is a book board or some other hobby, are experiencing sniping and general dissatisfaction. I sometimes wonder if we're all just discontent from oversaturation in opinion and sensory overload and overcontextualizing what's been written in the heat of the moment. Or... maybe that's just me.
-

 

[Rob B]

There might be oversaturation, who knows.

We go through one of these venting/purging sessions every few months, or at least once per year.

In the old days of the forum, the venting/purging would always be signaled by a new Jordan vs. Martin thread.

Lastly folks, take a step back and try not to put forth any personal attacks. That can very easily happen in a thread like this.

 

[Eventine]

Hmm…
As for long threads, maybe they should have a time duration (for a popular topic, start a new one every year?) or page limit (start a new one after x number of posts). I'm not going to remember half of what's been discussed in a thread that's over 20 pages in length. This is the drawback to the What Can you Tell Me About X Author thread.

Raule, I think that may be a pretty good idea. It seems to work well for the "Reading in <month>" threads, maybe something similar would work for recommendations? I'm not sure though - the recommendation requests tend not to come from established members of the site.

Anyway, that's only covered off two or three of my complaints. Come on people, let's work through the list, and after that we can get cracking on solving the global warming problem, feed the starving and establish world peace!

 

[KatG]

Yes, KatG, a thread on what one should and shouldn't read would be great. Elitism at its finest. I agree, one shouldn't have to read certain titles, but then, how would we know which is "better"? Its like modern art. Since most of it looks like a 5-year old made it, you really can't have a meaningful discussion about a piece of art nowadays without understanding its relative historical significance.

hmmm...I wonder if the relationship between art and writing is really that close. that would mean Goodkinds writing...

Can I assume you're joking here, or did you actually not understand what I was saying?

 

[wolfbane19]

I'm still relatively new to the board so I may just not know what I'm talking about but what I'd like to see is more general discussion of various novels, not just recommendations and debates over the quality of the writer/work (though I'm guilty of starting/participating in threads just likes these) but rather discussion of the finer points of the novel, what you like/dislike about the story/characters, and other such topics. I've noticed plenty of these types of discussions in the specific author forums but these boards seem rarely frequented and many of my favorite authors are a bit more obscure. I also realize that these discussions happen frequently in the "Book Club" section but because of my lack of money/time I feel that my participation in the book club would not be consistent and I'm not quite sure about the protocol involved in rehashing discussions of months gone past.

 

[Eventine]

...I also realize that these discussions happen frequently in the "Book Club" section but because of my lack of money/time I feel that my participation in the book club would not be consistent and I'm not quite sure about the protocol involved in rehashing discussions of months gone past.

Go for it - some of the threads there are still getting posts years after the original discussion.

 

[ChrisW]

Just curious. Who's the kid who loves Jordan?

As for the reccomendations. If you can have a sub forum for books people can't remember surely you can have one for reccomendations. Or even combine those to into one sub forum. I've said my piece on this before so I'll leave it at that.