Thoughts on Conan the Barbarian and short stories by Robert E Howard.

[Cicero]

Thanks for this, Cicero! Will check out Howard. Somehow I thought Connan was by E.R. Burroughs, lol. Don't know why I thought that exactly. Byw, do you like Burroughs? How'd you compare him with Howard? I guess he's more sci fi, but some of his works seem to have a connanesque vibe...

Btw, agree about CA Smith, one of my favorite writers... IMO above Lovecraft (also good in certain ways)

Howard and Burroughs were contemporaries and given that Howard was an A very avid reader,and well read probably had an influence on Howard. But overall, Howard is the better writer. in terms characterization story telling . Howard wrote fantasy , Horror , some science fiction Historical non fantasy adventure stories. westerns , detective stories , fight stories . In his relatively brief career as writer 1924 to 1936 , he was quite prolific. The sad part is had he not committed suicide at age 30 , he'd have become an ever better writer . I think it likely he would abandoned fantasy , science fiction and horror in favor of Detective stories and Westerns but, I think that eventually, he might come back to genres from his early career of Fantasy , Science Fiction and horror .

 

[Hobbit]

What Cicero said, RM: although Edgar Rice Burroughs books generally are older. For what it's worth, I like them too, for their sheer enthusiasm and vivid imagery. The first John Carter book, Princess of Mars, I reviewed HERE, which may give you an idea of ERB's importance to the genre. They're not particularly fancy, but they are entertaining and good fun.

And with John Carter (who you may have been thinking of instead of Conan) there's no denying how much of an influence ERB was on Golden Age writers. Heinlein, and more recently Mike Moorcock are just two examples.

Although the movie John Carter was not entirely in line with the original stories, I liked the film and would have loved to have seen a sequel.

 

[Cicero]

What Cicero said, RM: although Edgar Rice Burroughs books generally are older. For what it's worth, I like them too, for their sheer enthusiasm and vivid imagery. The first John Carter book, Princess of Mars, I reviewed HERE, which may give you an idea of ERB's importance to the genre. They're not particularly fancy, but they are entertaining and good fun.

And with John Carter (who you may have been thinking of instead of Conan) there's no denying how much of an influence ERB was on Golden Age writers. Heinlein, and more recently Mike Moorcock are just two examples.

Although the movie John Carter was not entirely in line with the original stories, I liked the film and would have loved to have seen a sequel.

ERB still inspires and influences writers to this day The Arbella of Mars trilogy by Davis D Levin . There is definitely a homage to ERB in this one .Aalso there are other writers continuation or ERB series , and some years a go Jose Phillip Farmer did two prequels novels dealing with the city of Opar And he also did th Tazan like pastiche Lord Tyler.


I love ERB's version Mars ! And I loved the John Carter film which should have become a major film franchise and would have been if Disney habits bungled it.

 

[Raya]

As far as I know, he also inspired Leigh Brackett, and she inspired Ray Bradbury.
To be honest, I find ERB's books a little dry. I don't know how to explain it, but I like it when the author paints pictures for me with his words. For example, when two characters are fighting, I don't just want to know what punches they're throwing, I want to know what the weather is like and how they're dressed and things like that.
Howard has all that and ERB doesn't. But without him, there would be no Lee Brackett's Mars, which I adore.
Sometimes I even regret that there weren't really any Martians on Mars...

 

[Cicero]

As far as I know, he also inspired Leigh Brackett, and she inspired Ray Bradbury.
To be honest, I find ERB's books a little dry. I don't know how to explain it, but I like it when the author paints pictures for me with his words. For example, when two characters are fighting, I don't just want to know what punches they're throwing, I want to know what the weather is like and how they're dressed and things like that.
Howard has all that and ERB doesn't. But without it, there would be no Lee Brackett's Mars, which I adore.
Sometimes I even regret that there weren't really any Martians on Mars...

Anne McCaffrey Pern novels perhaps ?

 

[oberon55]

When I was a kid I'd ride my bike to a used book store close to the house. The books were not kept in any order just crammed however they would fit. At least they were kept in different sections more or less by genre. I would dig for hours to find a book I had not read, I could usually find a Tarzan or some other ERB book.

I guess they were published in the 1950s and were a lot smaller than normal size paperbacks. I do remember the cover price being 25 or 35 cents. I would get a quarter a week allowance & could buy 2 of these books. I guess I probably read close to 80 or 90 books by ERB. Everything from The Mucker to Monster Men.

Even as a kid I started picking up on the fact that most of them were basically the same story with different characters but I didn't care. I still liked them.

Burroughs gave me hundreds if not thousands of hours of entertainment. He actually spoiled me & it was sad when I realized that my other favorite pulp authors (Howard, Lovecraft & Smith) had not published close to a hundred books each.

 

[Cicero]

When I was a kid I'd ride my bike to a used book store close to the house. The books were not kept in any order just crammed however they would fit. At least they were kept in different sections more or less by genre. I would dig for hours to find a book I had not read, I could usually find a Tarzan or some other ERB book.

I guess they were published in the 1950s and were a lot smaller than normal size paperbacks. I do remember the cover price being 25 or 35 cents. I would get a quarter a week allowance & could buy 2 of these books. I guess I probably read close to 80 or 90 books by ERB. Everything from The Mucker to Monster Men.

Even as a kid I started picking up on the fact that most of them were basically the same story with different characters but I didn't care. I still liked them.

Burroughs gave me hundreds if not thousands of hours of entertainment. He actually spoiled me & it was sad when I realized that my other favorite pulp authors (Howard, Lovecraft & Smith) had not published close to a hundred books each.

I recommend Kothar Barbarian Swordsman by Francis Gardens Fox There are 6 books worth of stories . Kotahr lives in the distant fire on a distant world where science has gone away and Magic has come back. Francis Gardner Fox is famous for have been the the Co Creator of DC's Dr Fate. He also dis stories for the Warrren Magazine Group . Eerie and Creepy and at one point involved in doing Conan the Barbarian Comics.

Godman by John Bloodstone
Elak of Atlantis by Henry Kuttner
Throngar by L Spague De Camp

I will leave it at that for now.

 

[oberon55]

I recommend Kothar Barbarian Swordsman by Francis Gardens Fox There are 6 books worth of stories . Kotahr lives in the distant fire on a distant world where science has gone away and Magic has come back. Francis Gardner Fox is famous for have been the the Co Creator of DC's Dr Fate. He also dis stories for the Warrren Magazine Group . Eerie and Creepy and at one point involved in doing Conan the Barbarian Comics.

Godman by John Bloodstone
Elak of Atlantis by Henry Kuttner
Throngar by L Spague De Camp

I will leave it at that for now.

I have read all of them. I think you are talking about the character Thongor the barbarian by Lin Carter. He wrote 5 or 6 books in the series. I always thought they were watered down imitations of Conan.

I did like Thundar: Man of Two Worlds (1971) by John Bloodstone.

At one time I almost had the complete run of Eerie Magazine but I lost them in a flood from a tropical storm. Creepy & Eerie were where I first encountered Frank Frazetta's artwork. He would go on to become one of the biggest fantasy book cover artists ever. He did most of the Lin Carter & L. Sprague de Camp Conan book covers. Funnily enough he also did several ERB covers. I truly believe it was his cover that made me check out Conan the Conqueror (1967) (aka Hour of the Dragon) way back in 1968 which was the first novel I ever read.

 

[Cicero]

I have read all of them. I think you are talking about the character Thongor the barbarian by Lin Carter. He wrote 5 or 6 books in the series. I always thought they were watered down imitations of Conan.

Yes, Lin Carter , my bad . Faulty memory on mar part.



I did like Thundar: Man of Two Worlds (1971) by John Bloodstone.

At one time I almost had the complete run of Eerie Magazine but I lost them in a flood from a tropical storm. Creepy & Eerie were where I first encountered Frank Frazetta's artwork. He would go on to become one of the biggest fantasy book cover artists ever. He did most of the Lin Carter & L. Sprague de Camp Conan book covers. Funnily enough he also did several ERB covers. I truly believe it was his cover that made me check out Conan the Conqueror (1967) (aka Hour of the Dragon) way back in 1968 which was the first novel I ever read.

Yes , Lin Carter did Throngor , I sometimes do confuse both L Sprague De Camp and Lin Carter on certain books. Oh well., faulty memory



Frank Frazetta did some of the covers on the Ace 12 volume series and Boris Vallejo did the rest. Irmrmeber that series well, Those were great Cover Pages . That 12 volumes series how found Conan. Kane , John Carter of Mars , The Eternal Champion and many many more . He was great ! The problem with modern anscience fiction and horror book cover art is it's lacking when comparison .

And form Eerie magazine there also Esteban Maroto Dax The Warrior

 

[Raya]

Anne McCaffrey Pern novels perhaps ?

I read these books a long time ago. My dad loved reading science fiction and fantasy books and literally filled the house with them. He also taught me to read when I was 3. By the time I was an adult, I had read them all.

Yes , Lin Carter did Throngor , I sometimes do confuse both L Sprague De Camp and Lin Carter on certain books. Oh well., faulty memory



Frank Frazetta did some of the covers on the Ace 12 volume series and Boris Vallejo did the rest. Irmrmeber that series well, Those were great Cover Pages . That 12 volumes series how found Conan. Kane , John Carter of Mars , The Eternal Champion and many many more . He was great ! The problem with modern anscience fiction and horror book cover art is it's lacking when comparison .

And form Eerie magazine there also Esteban Maroto Dax The Warrior

I understand that barbarians were very popular at the time.

 

[Cicero]

I read these books a long time ago. My dad loved reading science fiction and fantasy books and literally filled the house with them. He also taught me to read when I was 3. By the time I was an adult, I had read them all.



I understand that barbarians were very popular at the time.

In the 70's you Conan Comic books and later in that decade Coan Pastiches began showing up in a big way.

 

[Raya]

You're probably going to laugh at me, but I read some of Robert Salvatore's Drizzt books first, and it was only a few years later that I started reading Robert Howard. I really liked the world he created. He did about the same thing as Kate Elliot, whose books I talked about in another thread. He chopped up historical countries and peoples and then made his own world out of those pieces.
So I liked the world of Conan the Barbarian, but not the main character. He reminded me a lot of Wulfgar from Robert Salvatore's books, and I couldn't stand Wulfgar because he was phenomenally stupid and hysterical. But then I realised that Robert Howard had invented Conan much earlier than Salvatore had invented Wulfgar, and that Wulfgar was just a stupid parody of Conan. I started to like him a lot more after that.

 

[Cicero]

You're probably going to laugh at me, but I read some of Robert Salvatore's Drizzt books first, and it was only a few years later that I started reading Robert Howard. I really liked the world he created. He did about the same thing as Kate Elliot, whose books I talked about in another thread. He chopped up historical countries and peoples and then made his own world out of those pieces.
So I liked the world of Conan the Barbarian, but not the main character. He reminded me a lot of Wulfgar from Robert Salvatore's books, and I couldn't stand Wulfgar because he was phenomenally stupid and hysterical. But then I realised that Robert Howard had invented Conan much earlier than Salvatore had invented Wulfgar, and that Wulfgar was just a stupid parody of Conan. I started to like him a lot more after that.

Howard wrote and Essay on the Hyborain Age where the sketched out the world in which Conan lived which is about 15,000 years before recorded history . King Kull existed in a far earlier earlier time called Thurian age of about 100,000 years ago..

 

[Hobbit]

You're probably going to laugh at me, but I read some of Robert Salvatore's Drizzt books first, and it was only a few years later that I started reading Robert Howard.

Not at all - it's not what we do here. Series such as Terry Brooks' Shannara, the Forgotten Realms and the Dragonlance series are how often a new reader finds access to the genre. Of course, our mission is to then get readers onto what we see as the good stuff...

 

[Cicero]

Not at all - it's not what we do here. Series such as Terry Brooks' Shannara, the Forgotten Realms and the Dragonlance series are how often a new reader finds access to the genre. Of course, our mission is to then get readers onto what we see as the good stuff...

Absolutely !

 

[Cicero]

In the 12 volume ace Conan series doens by L Sprague De Camp and Lin Carter the story Conan The Flame Knife. was originally not a Conan story . The main character was adventurer Francis Xavier Good, known as El Borak . They changed the character to Conan and added fantasy elements . The original story title was Three-Bladed Doom and it was republished in it's largely original form in 1977.

 

[Raya]

Howard wrote and Essay on the Hyborain Age where the sketched out the world in which Conan lived which is about 15,000 years before recorded history . King Kull existed in a far earlier earlier time called Thurian age of about 100,000 years ago..

I read that essay. But to create a fictional period of Earth's history, he needed bits of real history, and he had to know it very well. Robert Howard also obviously knew the mythology of various nations very well. For example, to name his imaginary countries Acheron and Stygia after the rivers that flow in Hades in Greek mythology, he had to know that mythology very well.
I also like the reference in one of his books to the Picts drinking heather ale. It's an obvious reference to a poem by Robert Stevenson with exactly the same title. It's about the Picts and the cruel Scottish king who wiped them all out.

As I recall, Tolkien wrote something similar, claiming that he was describing an imaginary time rather than an imaginary world. I suppose it was common to write like that in the days when palaeontology and archaeology were relatively young sciences, and it was easier for readers to imagine the existence of lost empires that existed before the Ice Age.

Not at all - it's not what we do here. Series such as Terry Brooks' Shannara, the Forgotten Realms and the Dragonlance series are how often a new reader finds access to the genre. Of course, our mission is to then get readers onto what we see as the good stuff...

I've tried to read some of the books in the Dragonlance and Shannara series, but it's not my cup of tea. But the Drow in Robert Salvatore's books and the Underdark where they lived seemed very interesting to me.
Sometimes I even feel sorry that Robert Howard lived, was born and died long before Robert Salvatore started writing his books. If they had written a book together, the Drow could have made a real mess of the kingdoms of the Hyborian Age.
Well, Robert Howard had some very interesting serpent people in his books. Too bad he didn't write a story told from the point of view of a man or woman from that snake nation.

 

[Cicero]

I read that essay. But to create a fictional period of Earth's history, he needed bits of real history, and he had to know it very well. Robert Howard also obviously knew the mythology of various nations very well. For example, to name his imaginary countries Acheron and Stygia after the rivers that flow in Hades in Greek mythology, he had to know that mythology very well.
I also like the reference in one of his books to the Picts drinking heather ale. It's an obvious reference to a poem by Robert Stevenson with exactly the same title. It's about the Picts and the cruel Scottish king who wiped them all out.

As I recall, Tolkien wrote something similar, claiming that he was describing an imaginary time rather than an imaginary world. I suppose it was common to write like that in the days when palaeontology and archaeology were relatively young sciences, and it was easier for readers to imagine the existence of lost empires that existed before the Ice Age.



I've tried to read some of the books in the Dragonlance and Shannara series, but it's not my cup of tea. But the Drow in Robert Salvatore's books and the Underdark where they lived seemed very interesting to me.
Sometimes I even feel sorry that Robert Howard lived, was born and died long before Robert Salvatore started writing his books. If they had written a book together, the Drow could have made a real mess of the kingdoms of the Hyborian Age.
Well, Robert Howard had some very interesting serpent people in his books. Too bad he didn't write a story told from the point of view of a man or woman from that snake nation.

Robert E Howard's mother whom he was very close to, went into comma and wasn't coming out if , that was the tipping point that made him decide to end his life . He had one point, been dating a school teacher but that didn't last. Had she stay in his life, Howard would have made it, because he would have had someone to help him though it. He could have possibly lived to very ripe old age and might gotten to meet R A Salvatore and maybe he might gotten to befriend Karl Edward Wager and save him. It would have nice if gotten know both of these men and all the others an and gotten to read The hobbit and the LOTR and the Silmarillion . he would have marveled at what Tolkien created. Howard was already a really good writer early is his life , had he lived he'd have gotten better . Imagine what else might have written if he had more time than he also himself . I think he would be truly amazed at how popular and beloved his stories and characters have become and are a part of popular culture . He would be happy knowing how many writers he inspired and how many lives his stories have touched , including my own.

 

[Raya]

It's very hard when something terrible happens to your father or mother. And of course it would be so much better if talented people lived long enough to write lots of interesting books.
Well, at least there was Karl Edward Wager to write new Bran Mak Morn stories. Maybe someone will write a good story about the Snake People, too.

 

[Cicero]

It's very hard when something terrible happens to your father or mother. And of course it would be so much better if talented people lived long enough to write lots of interesting books.
Well, at least there was Karl Edward Wager to write new Bran Mak Morn stories. Maybe someone will write a good story about the Snake People, too.

Your correct. Both my parent made it into there 90's but it was still very hard watching them pass away.

Karl Edward Wagner's Bran Mak Morn The Legion From the Shadow is a great sword and sorcery novel in its own right . Yes , I think Robert E Howard would liked it alot and he would liked Wagner Conan Novel Conan The Road of Kings. and would have loved his Kane stories too, I think he would have also appreciated Poul Anderson's Conan The Rebel.

Yes , Id like a good novel a revolving around the Serpent folk maybe as part of a King Kull novel ?