Write One, Sub One

A Princely Wager back from Every Day Fiction with very detailed feedback from three different readers. Unfortunately, I'm too new to micro fiction to know what to do with that feedback.

" Vote: Reject I like what you have here so far, but it doesn't feel complete. What is the relationship between the m.c. and Mary? Are they best of friends, sisters, frenemies? I just wasn't sure. I also am not sure why they are there at the carnival. It feels like there is some purpose, not just on a lark, but again, I'm only guessing. It's definitely a well written, interesting scene, but not enough of a story, in my opinion, for Every Day Fiction.
Vote: Reject Being very short isn't by itself a mark against acceptance, but it's very tough to be complete as a story and be very short when there is still lots of room for more words. As it stands, this is a nice little vignette, a moment in two people’s lives, one that may be memorable for them, but we need more to make it important for us, the reader.
Vote: Reject It's a great concept, but I needed to know why these women were betting on kissing frogs. Do they really believe there's a prince? What kind of world is this; one with magic where princes really might be frog-cursed, or our normal world where that's a delusion? Either way, we just need a hint of what's driving this — loneliness, desperation, alcohol, just being silly with friends, wanting to really be a princess?"

I don't think there is anyway to address all the issues they raise without substantially lengthening the story. I'm also not convinced that the story wouldn't be diluted if I did that. I'm not sending it anywhere else until I figure this out.
 
Facing said:
A Princely Wager back from Every Day Fiction with very detailed feedback from three different readers. Unfortunately, I'm too new to micro fiction to know what to do with that feedback.

" Vote: Reject I like what you have here so far, but it doesn't feel complete. What is the relationship between the m.c. and Mary? Are they best of friends, sisters, frenemies? I just wasn't sure. I also am not sure why they are there at the carnival. It feels like there is some purpose, not just on a lark, but again, I'm only guessing. It's definitely a well written, interesting scene, but not enough of a story, in my opinion, for Every Day Fiction.
Vote: Reject Being very short isn't by itself a mark against acceptance, but it's very tough to be complete as a story and be very short when there is still lots of room for more words. As it stands, this is a nice little vignette, a moment in two people’s lives, one that may be memorable for them, but we need more to make it important for us, the reader.
Vote: Reject It's a great concept, but I needed to know why these women were betting on kissing frogs. Do they really believe there's a prince? What kind of world is this; one with magic where princes really might be frog-cursed, or our normal world where that's a delusion? Either way, we just need a hint of what's driving this — loneliness, desperation, alcohol, just being silly with friends, wanting to really be a princess?"

I don't think there is anyway to address all the issues they raise without substantially lengthening the story. I'm also not convinced that the story wouldn't be diluted if I did that. I'm not sending it anywhere else until I figure this out.
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Good.....it's been so long I had forgotten they provide significant feedback.

my input......meeeeeh. They want a longer story. This isn't for them but it certainly could be for Microfiction Monday or possibly the other micro fiction pubs.

There's nothing wrong with the story IMO and I really like it.
 
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I want to be supportive, but I have to agree with the readers/voters. There isn’t a story here, because a story has a beginning, a middle, and an end – and this one just has the beginning and the middle.

It’s set up like a joke: the premise is established, the intensification follows on cue, but when it comes to the punchline . . . it doesn’t.

We don’t need to know more about the characters or the setting or how the characters came to be in the setting, any more than we need to know more about the bar except that a priest, a minister, and a rabbi walk into it.

But fiction involves making the reader say, “What happens next?” and then answering that question in a way that satisfies the reader, or at least some readers. In this one, any reader is going to want to know:

- did she kiss the frog?

- if so, what happened as a result?

- if not, what happened as a result?

Answer two of those questions in a satisfying way, and you’ve got a story.

Now, me, I can never resist messing around with other people’s copy, so here’s what I would do:

Goliath squirmed, but I planted a big wet one on his lipless mouth. A moment later, I was holding a naked, dripping prince.


I turned to Mary and said, “Told you I was a princess.”


Then I let him go. He tried to run but the crowd caught him.


I patted my swelling belly and said, “And this little tadpole is going to know his daddy.”
 
Matthew Hughes said:
I want to be supportive, but I have to agree with the readers/voters. There isn’t a story here, because a story has a beginning, a middle, and an end – and this one just has the beginning and the middle.

It’s set up like a joke: the premise is established, the intensification follows on cue, but when it comes to the punchline . . . it doesn’t.

We don’t need to know more about the characters or the setting or how the characters came to be in the setting, any more than we need to know more about the bar except that a priest, a minister, and a rabbi walk into it.

But fiction involves making the reader say, “What happens next?” and then answering that question in a way that satisfies the reader, or at least some readers. In this one, any reader is going to want to know:

- did she kiss the frog?

- if so, what happened as a result?

- if not, what happened as a result?

Answer two of those questions in a satisfying way, and you’ve got a story.

Now, me, I can never resist messing around with other people’s copy, so here’s what I would do:

Goliath squirmed, but I planted a big wet one on his lipless mouth. A moment later, I was holding a naked, dripping prince.


I turned to Mary and said, “Told you I was a princess.”


Then I let him go. He tried to run but the crowd caught him.


I patted my swelling belly and said, “And this little tadpole is going to know his daddy.”
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I thought about this all night and I agree that I could carry on the story in a manner like what you've done above. I just can't see a way to do it and stay under a hundred words. I think I need to get over myself about the hundred word limit.

I'm also not certain that I need to answer questions like, like how are the women related, why are they there...

You don't seem to think I have to. I just need to write act three. I can do that. I could maybe even flesh act one and two a bit.

By the by, you are being supportive. You took the time to try and help me. I appreciate that.
 
Facing said:
I thought about this all night and I agree that I could carry on the story in a manner like what you've done above. I just can't see a way to do it and stay under a hundred words. I think I need to get over myself about the hundred word limit.

I'm also not certain that I need to answer questions like, like how are the women related, why are they there...
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Exactly. See the thing is microfiction is a completely different creature. And I'll say again there is nothing wrong with this microfiction, it's just that EDF wants something different.

This is a damn near perfect microfiction. I don't want to get into a full discussion of microfiction in contrast to flash or prose poetry or short or longer works but they often break the rules.

You don't need more than is there. It's up to the reader to fill in the details in whatever way they want (just as Matt did). This is often how microfiction works. It is NOT short story, it does not have to explore details and relationships like longer works, it does not even have to be a 'complete' story.

I'll say again there is NOTHING wrong with this story. Send it to Microfiction Monday.
 
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kennychaffin said:
Exactly. See the thing is microfiction is a completely different creature. And I'll say again there is nothing wrong with this microfiction, it's just that EDF wants something different.

This is a damn near perfect microfiction. I don't want to get into a full discussion of microfiction in contrast to flash or prose poetry or short or longer works but they often break the rules.

You don't need more than is there. It's up to the reader to fill in the details in whatever way they want (just as Matt did). This is often how microfiction works. It is NOT short story, it does not have to explore details and relationships like longer works, it does not even have to be a 'complete' story.

I'll say again there is NOTHING wrong with this story. Send it to Microfiction Monday.
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I hear you Kenny, but I'm looking to qualify for SFFWA and that limits the markets I'm trying to break into. I just went through the list and the sweet spot seems to be about 750 words. I'm still planning to participate in the Micro Fiction contests but I think I may take Matthew's advice on this one and flesh out the story so I can submit it to one of the qualifying pro mags.
 
Understand. All depends on your goals. :D Microfiction is certainly not the way to make $$$ or to qualify for SFFWA (any more than poetry). Nor is flash a good way for most of the same reasons. Write longer stories. Your writing is fine.
 
Facing said:
I'm looking to qualify for SFFWA and that limits the markets I'm trying to break into
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My impression -- and it's only an impression -- is that 2,500 to 3,000 words makes a good length for an sff story. I'm working in the 7,500 to 15,000 range (novelettes) but I'm selling only to F&SF and invitation-only anthos.

Now, 2,500 to 3,000 doesn't give much room for backstory and character development, but if you're working within a fairy-tale motif, as this story does, you don't need to do more than sketch the setting. You can get right into the action, as you do.

The question then becomes, "Why is she kissing frogs?" The usual trope is to find a prince. Then the question becomes, "What does she want with a prince?" I supplied a comic answer. But you could go on from there to ask, post-kiss, "Is this the right prince?" And then, "Why does it have to be the right prince?"

That's where you can build in your twist -- a story like this pretty much needs a twist.

Ultimately, it all comes down to the crucial questions at the heart of most stories: what is the character trying to achieve, and how will she do it? And, of course, what will it mean in the end?
 
I've been thinking about this business of writing to a fixed length and I don't think it's a good idea for beginners. For one thing, it's harder than having an open-ended field to romp around in. And I believe a story has to be the length it takes to do the job the story is trying to do.
 
and on the other hand a completely open-ended field could result in endless wandering. :D

I know that's the case with many beginners.....they just keep working, reworking, and never finishing.

You are certainly right that each story is going to be different and needs to find its own length and method of expression.

I just struggled a bit trying to write a suitcase story (flash) for this month's prompt and as part of it wanted to try squeezing it down into a microfiction as well. You can see the results such as they are (can't say I'm particularly loving either version of the story) here.
But it is one of the few things I've been able to complete this month so that's a good thing. :(
 
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My problem stems from still trying to figure out what is and is not a story. I have dozens of examples of what I thought were complete stories when I wrote them, only to have readers tell me I created an interesting start to something larger. Those starts vary in length from a hundred words to over ten thousand.

The damned bunnies are always threatening to derail my efforts to stay on track too.

I've read others on this forum comment about starting a new story and being able to gauge it's approximate finished length, but I can't do that - at least not yet.

Left to my own devices everything I start would end up like my first novel attempt - 300k words and 20+pov characters who I find so equally interesting it took me a year just to figure out who my protagonist is. I still haven't settled on a main antagonist. :(

I need a goal to aim for and permission to miss the mark. For example, with the short story contests we usually have a limit of 5k words. If I aim for 4500 and come in between 3-5k it's a win.

For now, that's the best I can do.
 
Facing said:
My problem stems from still trying to figure out what is and is not a story. I have dozens of examples of what I thought were complete stories when I wrote them, only to have readers tell me I created an interesting start to something larger.
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It sounds to me as if you’re not looking/feeling deep enough into what you’re doing. Every story is about something. If you know what it’s about, you know how it has to end. You may not know what it’s about when you start it – I usually don’t – but as it develops and characters make choices, you can begin to see into it.

I’ve just written the first draft of a story for an anthology where I was asked to fill in for an invitee who failed to deliver. I start out with a hardboiled detective meeting the president of a mining company who has insisted that the PI keep their encounter completely confidential. So no one knows the detective is where he is, doing what he’s doing. The client tells him he has to find a company employee who has allegedly walked off with a priceless gem.

By the time I get to that point, I’m more than a thousand words in and still don’t know what the story is about. So I continue a logical extrapolation of the premise, with the PI getting more information, then beginning to look for the absconder, starting by going to his home/private laboratory. There he finds something unusual. I won’t go into detail, but it’s a space opera story set in my far-future Archonate universe, where interdimensional realities are part of the background.

As the PI assesses the situation, the client arrives with a weapon and it becomes clear that the whole point of bringing the detective there was because he has a reputation for absolute confidentiality. The client wants him to do something very dangerous, which may well get him killed. Turns out the mining man and his scientist have been messing around with interdimensional forces way beyond anybody’s control. And the kind of experiments they’ve been mounting generate energy fields that restructure the brain – i.e., they drive you insane.

The thing is, I was more than two thousand words in before the man with the gun arrived. (Raymond Chandler’s classic advice: if you don’t know what happens next, have a man with a gun enter the room). But at that point, I’m asking myself: what does the client want? What does the PI – known as a confidential operative – have that the mining man needs? Answer: complete secrecy.

The client brought the PI in to get him to do something that might be totally lethal. So now I know what it’s about: one character trying to put something over on another, with death on the line, in a Frankenstein vein. And since I want my PI to survive, it becomes a question of how does he turn the tables on the adversary?

Answering that question not only tells me how the story ends, but where. Because once the question at the heart of the story is resolved, the story is over. I can stop writing, except for a little paragraph that adds a grace note to the whole business.

So you have to learn to ask yourself: whose story is this, and what is it about at the most fundamental level? What is the basic dramatic question I am asking by having my characters do what they do, and what are the possible answers?

If you know why your character is kissing frogs, you know what the story’s about. Getting to the end becomes a lot easier and, also, you recognize the end when you get there.
 
Matthew Hughes said:
It sounds to me as if you’re not looking/feeling deep enough into what you’re doing. Every story is about something. If you know what it’s about, you know how it has to end. You may not know what it’s about when you start it – I usually don’t – but as it develops and characters make choices, you can begin to see into it.
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You've given me a lot to think about. It ties in with the idea of a draft zero.

The idea of theme seems intimidating, but I'm hopeful it gets easier with practice, like everything else in life.
 
Facing said:
The idea of theme seems intimidating, but I'm hopeful it gets easier with practice, like everything else in life.
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Here's something to make it easier: you've read scores of novels, seen even more movies, so you know how stories work. And even if you hadn't seen those scores and hundreds, it's wired into you. We know stories when we encounter them.

You'll be all right.
 
Inheritance back from Fantastic Stories of the Imagination. The email went to my spam folder so anyone else who has submitted them might want to add the address to their list of contacts so they don't have the same problem.

I've sent the story off to Every Day Fiction to continue beta testing their new system.
 
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