Just curious

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I am so delighted that people here work in the spirit of harmony and tolerance as well as understanding :). By the way, this is the first "cross religious" thread I have seen that remains so amicable and for that matter, truly informative beyond the 10th post!! I must congratulate all here for this :).

For the few Taoist and Buddhist here:-
saintjon:-
I must admit as a practising and native Buddhist and Taoist, I never heard of this sutra, philosophy, master, deity, immortal or way, called the Tao of Pooh, throughout Asia. Can you explain the basic philosophy behind this new branch, I would believe, of Taoism? Buddhist and Taoist accept that the doctrines and paths varies as time and condition varies, and personally, following the Seeker Path, this intrigues me.

Cygnus:-
Sigh, the one reason why Buddhism and Taoism is dying is because our hands are tied down when it comes to proselytising. We are taught to incorporate the Way and Path gently into our daily living, and in helping others, but never impose and when being asked, guide people to think whether the teaching is for them or not.

But all things, including teachings and religions are in themselves impermanent, component objects coming together that eventually, will cease to be. One will grow out of the other, one will fade and the other wax. Philosophy changes, as do society, as do the Gods, but reality remains, for now and forever, and only the perception of reality alters.

Shar'lai:-
NeoPagan beliefs clearly complement Buddhism in many respects. Which of the paths of NeoPaganism do you follow, Wiccanism, Asatruism, Celtic Reconstructionist, Slavonic Recon, etc.. etc..?

NeoPaganism intrigues me, I must admit Shar'lai.
 
Well, my cosmology's based on incorporating too, although I never actually called it the way of the seeker! My goal is to try and incorporate the best of every religion into my beliefs.

The Tao of Pooh is a paperback book that is about 158 pages long, you can pick it up at the bookstore for about $20 Canadian. It explains Taoism through Winnie the Pooh and Winnie the Pooh through Taoism. I've also read the Tao te Ching, which is short and sweet as well, but not quite as accessible as the Tao of Pooh.

I love it when the science-minded people accuse religion of using catch-all words like "miracle" to describe things they just didn't understand, when science does the exact same thing. Ever come across the word "instinct" by chance?

And Sammie, I don't know about going to a better place when you die. What's so bad about this one, I figure? There would probably be dinks in heaven too. My afterlife thing is more like you go and rejoin this cosmic awareness whatever that is your true self out in the cosmos, blahblahblah... Where that comes from is this book I read where they said that it's odd that people believe something with a beginning could have no end. Therefore we have been around as long as existence. As for just living this once and then it's over, well, could be, but that wouldn't be so bad would it? It seems to me that I would be even more laid back about life if that were my belief, since this is the only chance I get everything becomes even more impernanent.

I've also taken to thinking of the planet as an organism, a living thing (and a tough one at that :)) and I think sometimes we don't give it enough credit for how much it can take (although we're definitely pushing it).
 
I believe in God (as in everything is connected through adjoining atoms, so anything you do affects everything else is some way - kind of a scientific karma - and faith and optimism and other things are ways of influencing certain things), ghosts etc.

I feel no need to be part of a certain religion, but I think everyone should believe in something.
 
Since u ask rumfuddle

I'd say, I was religious, but my faith is more self defined, and doesn't exactly fall into a defined religion per se. I believe in the soul and fate-we are all here for a reason, whatever that reason may be.

To me all the major religions say pretty much the same thing despite minor differences- they teach us morals, promote mutual understanding and respect, and the quest for self enlightenment. Religion provides us somethings that modern science can't provide- a sense of belonging and being- to not believe in anything greater than myself would leave me feeling devoid and empty. Religion's meant to bring people together, not drive them apart.

Biology alone says we're here to pass on our genes and that's it. Some say we were a mistake in evolution which will result in us scarring this planet before wiping each other out. That's too depressing for me - someone is there watching out for me, and that provides comfort.

I believe in the freedom to believe in what you want, as long as it doesn't impose on other people's beliefs. Religion should bring people closer together, not drive them apart over petty differences. I believe in life, friendship and family.

The afterlife- well I don't know about that- I'll cross that one when I come to it. In the meantime, I'll make the most of what little time I've got.
 
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I am a devout Christian... and I wouldn't have it any other way! :)

I cannot say that I believe in, or don't believe in faith it's just something I feel in your blood, something my soul understands that I can't put into words wihtout distorting the truth of it. God has moved mountains in my life... he's made the oceans roar in my defense. I love him with all that I am and have to give. And I believe this song perfectly sums up what Jesus would say to you if you would but lend him an ear...

"I've heard it said that a man would climb a mountain
Just to be with the one he loves
How many times has he broken that promise
It has never been done
I've never climbed the highest mountain
But I walked the hill of Calvary

Just to be with you,I'd do anything
There's not price I would not pay
Just to be with you, I'd give anything
I would give my life away

I've heard it said that a man would swim the ocean
Just to be with the one he loves
How many times has he broken that promise
It can never be done
I've never swam the deepest ocean
But I walked upon the raging sea

Just to be with you,I'd do anything
There's not price I would not pay
Just to be with you, I'd give anything
I would give my life away

I know that you don't understand the fullness of My love
How I died upon the cross for your sins
And I know you don't realize how much that I gave you
But I promise, I would do it all again

Just to be with you, I did everything
There's not price I did not pay
Just to be with you, I gave everything
Yes, I gave my life away"

I very rarely attend church, or read the bible but I don't feel that gathering or reading is as important as just accepting, understanding, and living by the truth.
 
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Hello Aik Haw, and others. I usually do not go into detail cause when asked I go on, and on, and on. But I also love this kind of topic, and I like it when I find a group of people that are willing to discuss it with open mindedness.

There was a time when my goddess had a name ... She was either Brigid, or Morrighan, depending on what I was feeling at the time. I called myself Celt, and worshipped the gods of Eire as my own. My faith was a blend of Celtic and Ecletic Wicca.

But over time that did not feel right to me. *sighs* Wicca is a religion of prayer, ritual, and ceremony, beautiful yes, but simply not my path. So while I still have a deep and abiding love for the land that is in my blood, I now realise that loving the land, and loving its gods, does not mean that I belong.

So who do I now worship? Well, I still worship a goddess, but she is nameless. She is Mother Earth, Mother Nature, Maiden, Mother, Crone; she is life and death, light and dark, good and bad. She is all.

Now, I call her goddess, but that is just what I am comfortable with. I believe that she is asexual. She is both male and female. I acknowledge that because to do so is to acknowledge balance, and balance is what I strive for in life.

I believe that the earth is a conscious entity, as are the trees, plants, and animals that reside here with us. I believe that everything has a soul, an essence, or an energy, and these energies fill the universe. I believe that we should respect them and keep them safe from harm if possible.

I believe in reincarnation, and acknowledge that I have experienced flashes from a past life. And I believe that when we die, our energies go to a heaven of sorts, to await a decision from the higher energies as to whether we remain or return.

I believe that if there is to be a Judgement day, then it will be a time when all souls will face judgement from the evolved energies. Those that remained closed minded and judgemental, those that ascribed to war instead of peace, those that killed or were cruel again and again with each returning to the earth, those that refused to learn and grow time after time, they will then be refused the right to continue. Their energies will be scattered throughout the universe. They will cease to be as they were.

Those that remain will continue to evolve and grow, but no longer will war ravage the land. It will be a time of infinite peace and wisdom.

That is my fundamental, no gloss, warts and all belief.

Now some have called me witch, but I do not call upon fairies and sprites, I do not call upon or use the powers of the gods. I use the energies around me. I use them every time I paint, every time I write, and when I divine dreams. I seek to create harmony within and without. I strive for balance, and draw from the energies around me to do so.

So do I pray? Not out loud, I do not. I believe that my goddess knows what is within me. She can hear my thoughts maybe better than she can hear my voice. Maybe you could call what I do praying, but it is a prayer of thought, not a prayer of words.

I believe that we are all being watched over. Not necessarily by our god or goddess, but definitely by entities that wish for us to evolve to a point where we can join them.

I believe in karma. I have seen it in action so many times to know that it exists. I also believe that we experience our karma to learn 'life lessons' and if we do not learn those lessons, then we are faced with the same situation time, and time again, until we do.

I do not ascribe to one set religious path, instead I seek to understand all faiths. It is only through that understanding that we will stop fear and hate.

I once read a quote of the Dalai Lama that summed up everything that I believe into four words. he said "My religion is kindness."

Hope I have not bored you all with my words.
 
Science and Spiriuality.
Officially I am RC, but I truely believe that it's all only a small piece
of a very big puzzle. Each religion attempts to deal with many of the same questions and the resulting religions are often cultures
reactions to what we believe are the answers. I know that I am very different from many who practice my religion but then there is a very big difference between "official" publically practiced beliefs and how spiritual we are inside. I just belive that there is a meaning to everything we do, it is our choice in how we choose to believe, worship or simply exist as beings.
 
To quote, in my opinion, a very great personage...

"I desire not a window into men's souls"

Personal belief is just that, personal... you should respect others rights and they yours..... end of story....

The quote was from a speech to the houses of Parliament by Queen Elizabeth I
 
Well it would seem I was wrong about this topic - I should have had more 'faith' in the open mindedness of my fellow forumites. :D Brace yourselves....this could be a little long winded. :D

Originally posted by Cygnus
I think that faith is VERY individual and should not be forced upon someone.
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I whole-heartedly agree with you on this point Cygnus. But I also see a difference between 'forcing beliefs' on people and simply 'teaching them about' a particular religion and letting them decide for themselves whether they can believe in it or not.(ie missionaries). :D

I also can't dispute the horrendous things that were done in the name of the Church over the course of history. People may or may not know that Pope John Paul officially apologised for these atrocities a little while ago. Of course this doesn't change the facts, but it does 'acknowledge' the fact that the Church isn't perfect.

My personal beliefs - I believe in a God that watches over us all, the Creator of everything. I believe in Jesus; Shan's poem says more than I ever could, about how much I trust in his love for me. As has also been mentioned, I am probably not quite a 'conventional' Catholic, in that I don't agree with some of the teachings. This comes about because in my own mind, I can't come to the same conclusions that they have come to. If I can't incorporate the message in my inner being, then I cannot believe in it. As Pirate Jen said

...religion tends to describe what people do and faith describes what they believe.

Religion is easy, but faith is difficult--it requires both thought and trust.
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I tend to think that all religions basically aspire to the same higher ideals - they just have a different way to reach this point. I also tend to think that all the one deity religions are praying to the same Person ie God, Allah etc. I notice we haven't heard from any Muslims yet - I hope they are going to share their views as well, and I hope that everyone will maintain the open-mindedness when they do. It would be a terrible shame if we let ourselves be influenced by the 'bad press' our fellow religious have had inflicted on them of late. :(
 
Shar'lai:-
Bore me? No, such truthful statements delights me as it allows me to better understand another person and behold the beauty within their worlds!!

I certainly would like to see a world where the aspects of violence and war fades. I however believe above all in One thing, balance. For me, peace balances violence, love balances hate, a person can never truly imbibe in peace if he has never tasted violence, can never dance in love, so long as she has never been stung by hate.

But we can always hope that a time will come when all will walk in the Pure Land/Tien Ping/Summerland/Tir Nan Org/Heaven/New Earth etc.. etc.. in eternal harmony and peace!!
 
Yeah, well... I already stated my opinion on a perfect existence.
 
I certainly would like to see a world where the aspects of violence and war fades. I however believe above all in One thing, balance. For me, peace balances violence, love balances hate, a person can never truly imbibe in peace if he has never tasted violence, can never dance in love, so long as she has never been stung by hate.
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I have to agree with you there completely. :)
 
I must say that I too am delightfully surprised at the openess and candor that all have displayed in discussing this topic - these are deeply personal feelings for a lot of folks, and to share them with all in such an open spirit is quite refreshing. It makes me both proud and happy to be associated with such a diverse, and understanding, group.

I also agree completely with SaintJon about The Tao of Pooh. This book was actually my first introduction to Taoism. I had already come to my own conclusions about "reality," and when discussing it with my wife she said, "Hmm, that sounds a lot like Taoism. Here, look at this little book I've got on my shelf." (So I like to think that I came by the beliefs the right way - I believed them first, then later found a label for them that seemed reasonably close!)

Anyway, The Tao of Pooh is by Benjamin Hoff, first published by Penguin in 1983, ISBN 0-14-006747-7. It's listed as a Humor title, which is a misnomer; the publisher was a little unclear on the concept. It actually is a delightful introduction into what Taoism is all about, and to me still captures it's essence quite well. Pooh is probably the quintessential Taoist! The book is still available, via Amazon or elsewhere. For the record, Hoff has same later, similar books, and there have been some other imitators (some using the "Pooh" model for non-Taoist topics), but I don't think any of these others has measured up to the original.
 
Slightly off topic but still on the subject of science and religeon, there was an interesting display in my university lobby by a Muslim writer proposing evidence pointing out the holes in Darwin's theorys and why the world must have been born through divine creation.
One of the more interesting examples (although all good) was the humble Bombadier Beetle. The writer quite rightly pointed out that the interior workings of the beetle (which has two chambers with different chemicals which when mixed form an explosive compound) could never have evolved because any mistake would have resulted in the poor little chap exploding. Therefore for the Bombadier Beetle to even exist it must have been created from scratch by something with quite an advanced knowledge of chemistry.
 
Mr. Kip,
<This is no criticism, but just as an explanation based upon what is known in modern day biology to an interesting question.>

As a student of biology, I can assure you that what you pointed out is not unknown to evolutionary biology.

I am not sure about this Bombadier beetle ( sounds like this makes a great party trick ) but I can tell you about the danger lurking within our own cells, which mirrors the Bombadier beetle. Yes, this danger lurks within you at this very moment!!

Our own cells contains structures we call lysosomes, which contains a nasty chemical called lysozyme. Lysozyme is used in lysis, and when used in small amounts, contributes to the cellular integrity. But, if woops, a huge release occurs, than bang, the cell is dead( more like digested )

Now, people points out that lysosomes therefore negates evolution. After all, why on Earth would nature if self evolved seek danger? After all, even unicellular eukaryotes like parameciums, chlamydia and amoebas have this structure, and clearly this is not merely for multicellular benefit!! This is actually not true, especially from an evolutionary standpoint. What people fail to note is that lysozymes are a natural byproduct of one of the aerobic protein synthesis pathway and instead of allowing the "byproduct" to disperse to the surrounding cellular structure, which will disrupt the integrity of other cells, the encapsulation via a simple double glycosylated lipopolysaccharide membrane effectively "stops" it from dispersing, while giving the cell the perfect tool for anything ranging from reticular repair to apoptosis, carrying with it of course the risk that if it did break....

However, the risk is smaller than gain, and this is why the structure provides a survival benefit!! The lysosomes provide (a) lesser disruption to surrounding cells, if multicellular (b) internal benefit (c) for multicellular organism, a weapon for the immune system to use (d) apoptosis, (e) and for unicellular organism, a perfect digestive mechanism and the only risk, well, if all goes wrong, wham!!

Of course, there is always a place for Divine Creation. No biologist will come forward and say outright that we are 100% sure that life emerged out of complete randomness. Heck, there are now evidence that natural selection may not be the only force in governing individual and population survival!!
 
Aren't lysomes a method for keeping cells pure? (ie: cells lyse when judged by the nucleus to be infected by improper DNA??) (It's been a while since biology)

I've heard lots of other theories that seem to hint that evolution theory isn't the be-all, end-all. How did eye-sight develop? Why do mitochondria have RNA--and, if they did act independantly, why don't they, now?

How can it possibly be a survivalist trait for humans to bear young which must be cared for and watched over for such an extended period of time?

Why can't we all photosynthesize? (would be highly useful, if you ask me. ;)

It's all a mystery :D --and a pleasant one to think of.
 
Originally posted by Pirate Jenn
Why can't we all photosynthesize? (would be highly useful, if you ask me. ;)
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I dunno, I think I prefer the current method. Something about sinking your teeth into a nice barbequed steak....
 
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